Author Topic: Totally registered just to ask this  (Read 2812 times)

Chrome Homura

  • New Challenger
  • *
  • Posts: 31
  • With these eyes, I can't lose!
    • View Profile
Totally registered just to ask this
« on: March 12, 2013, 09:37:26 PM »
Hey, I'm what I believe most would call a moderate player. Certainly on the lower end, but of the type one can't necessarily write off for a certain reason...

Simply put, the biggest problem I have with playing the adrenaline rush that is KOFXIII is that 90% of my gameplay revolves around the concept of "blinking". All round, every round, I'm evaluating whether or not my opponent is pressing a button of some sort, because if they are I firmly believe there should be one I can press that'll beat it, although I count blocking in order to punish DPs as being the same thing. This means my favorite place to be is at poke range, or varying long range fireball timings/spacings (Go-go XIII King! Air venom strikes are the best) I'm good at stuffing things with far  ;c;d or Tornado kicks, and know King's combos inside and out (my other chars are Flame Iori and Terry, whom I am less proficient with, although not quite dreadfully or equally so) but what all this means is that at the end of the day, I can make strong reads and blow up lower-level players, but my mental muscles are trained to do almost everything intuitively as opposed to consciously reacting to what I see (I rely on instinct more because my conscious reaction rate is simply below average) and as a result I tend to do things like randomly blow an EX rising tackle when both of us are holding down+back, even though my opponent didn't actually do anything (they were waiting for the other player to react, just like I was) and consistently lose to the stronger players (who are more patient by default.) What is known in my area simply as "the hold trick" is both my greatest weapon and my biggest weakness, as I tend to 50/50 when it comes to following up midscreen hits (I catch myself hopping at the opponent out of runs after resetting them more often than I'd like to)

Well, that's enough life story I guess. I'm guessing that the advice pros would have for a player like me would simply be to learn patience, but as you folks might guess I didn't make the effort of writing this post just to hear what I already know. What I do want to know is as follows:

What's a consistent way of training my eyes? Not my mind's eye, but my physical visual receptors. I can't help but suspect that my yomi (which I believe is already fairly strong) would be better off backed up by a set of muscles that didn't have to "guess" between getting thrown and eating a combo due to a baited reversal. When I commit to blocking, I feel any given opponent's chance of opening me up without a throw is reduced to 10%... but I can't react to the holes I see in my opponent's pressure, because by the time I realize I could beat that move with the reversal I didn't just throw out on wakeup it's too late to input it (and just barely so) because I'm back in blockstun. That's why I tend to get thrown, because the mindscrew from not being able to properly punish flawed pressure is such that I can't tech the throw (or worse, I'll eat command throws forever.) I don't think it's a matter of situation-specific things, just that the rush I get from simply playing the game makes me slow. Thus, again my basic question is: How do I train my reflexes to pick up the pace like the rest of me does?
Shen's is the Cr.C that pierces the heavens...


  • Scion of Flame
  • ****
  • Posts: 486
    • View Profile
Re: Totally registered just to ask this
« Reply #1 on: March 12, 2013, 11:40:10 PM »
You have to learn to do choices and commit with those.

Human reaction time is roughly 20frames for recognizing a specific object. Which is far too long in this kind of game. That's why you are screwd so much. Plus the mental impact you explain which make you freeze because your brain is still processing data.

However the amount of time for the brain to see something moving is 3-4frames at best. So you can do sometimes reversal extra fast as anti air or whiff punish a light etc. But it's not reliable, you saw something moving, but what? The time you need for processing what's happening is too long, that's why you can't really train it. You can reduce it by a small amount with practice but that's pretty much it.

Although, you can do choices and start the real mind games. Your opponent does a +3 d.A in guard, you have time to process this but you have to guess the next move, you can't see the next d.A with 4 start up frames and the gap in which you can do your reversal in time, let alone the fact of doing the motion. You have to chose whether guard, reversal normal, special or just roll.

In little gaps such as those between a d.A and a throw you have enough time for doing a cr.C in reaction, but if they mind this you can't react the fact they minded you mind a whiffed cr.C is deadly, and so on.

I won't make this extra long but that's the basical idea.

« Last Edit: March 12, 2013, 11:42:14 PM by Sharnt »
Follow me on Twitter for a lot of stuff on KoF XIII :

The Fluke

  • Legendary Wolf
  • *****
  • Posts: 521
    • View Profile
Re: Totally registered just to ask this
« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2013, 01:34:33 AM »
Simple tip that is key to me, to get the most out of my reflexes i need to listen to the game. I'm quicker to confirm hits if i hear them than if i see them, so doing both is crucial because it tells me what and how etc. So don't sit on skype talking or listen to music or something like that, listen to the game.

Might not work for everyone, but it does wonders for me.


  • Legendary Wolf
  • *****
  • Posts: 1432
    • View Profile
Re: Totally registered just to ask this
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2013, 06:48:01 AM »
Well, you're asking a number of things, but the main thing is how to train your body to react to what you see.

Well, there's a number of ways to do that, but mostly you should try to limit the opponent's options to a number of things. You see, the way you're approaching the game is by being able to respond to the possibilities this person can do in a certain situation. On the defense, you shouldn't really do that. You should coax them into a situation where they do something you want them to do, what is logical for them to do, but they end up doing exactly what you want them to do.

This is basically footsies. For example, something really basic, if you walk up to someone and you keep poking them with your st.B, there's two things that could happen. They could eat it or they could evade it. Evasion could be blocking, but it's also jumping, hopping, backdashing, something that allows them to avoid having a solid connection. With Terry, you continue to poke them, but it's a relatively safe move and positive on block. It's also very far reaching so you continue to poke them with this one move. You poke them from as far as you can afford.

This is where basic footsies comes into play. You change your next given response you have encouraged your opponent to do and do something else. If you use King, King's st.B is a low. You walk forward, st.B, you walk foward, st.B. They block twice. This time, you walk forward and throw them. They eat it. Why? Because they blocked low even though you have to stand to tech a throw. You did 1 thing that easily turned into a really scary mix up.

When you're on the defense though, you should use training mode to your advantage. Record moves or strings where you think something isn't safe or something you've been hit with before. Reaction is about muscle memory, but also repetition. You want to limit the amount of things you think about to punish with. Like Sharnt said, you should have already in your mind what you will do in a given situation. Put yourself in those scenarios and question why they do something or in what situations they do this. Then you're mentally prepared for when that situation comes up.

Mr Bakaboy

  • Scion of Flame
  • ****
  • Posts: 495
    • View Profile
Re: Totally registered just to ask this
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2013, 10:30:06 AM »
Personally I think your biggest problem everyone pretty much said. Most of it comes from repetition and practice. However if you want to fix what you are asking for in a reflex perception style I would recommend not focusing your eyes and try to play a game using the outer portion of your eyes rather then your inner. Doing this increases your reaction time from seeing things coming a lot faster, however it won't really replace practice and repetition, and it's probably pretty frustrating at first so I would recommend playing the computer on a lower level. It takes time to use it. I screwed with it for years before being really good at it.

The other is mastery of adrenaline, however that is a lot harder and is messier (i.e. adrenaline + rage = messy).
Say it with me now: "Variable input lag BAAAAAAD!!!"


  • Administrator
  • Legendary Wolf
  • *****
  • Posts: 2634
  • Practice everyday without neglect
    • View Profile
    • DesmondDELAGHETTO youtube page
Re: Totally registered just to ask this
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2013, 04:05:53 PM »
For me to react well to something I need to fully anticipate it and wait for it, then when I see any indication of it happen, then I take action.

I have found out a cool exercise in practice mode that I've been doing to help me with my reactions. I'll try to make a video about it. :)
"Do not place so much importance on winning. The fight itself has value."