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Ways to Improve Dream Cancel (part 1)

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Nagato1992:
Front Page:  I think the frontpage is well done. 

Other pages: Same as above, I see no real issues here.

Wiki:  Last time I checked the wiki, it seemed to be updated.  I only checked KoF13 though, so I cannot speak for the other KoF wiki's on the site.

The Community: I have reached out here to help the community, but I barely get replies and when I do, I totally forgot about the said issue.  Not to mention, I don't have the funds to afford a stream setup or anything.  If I did, I would have gladly streamed my "stable" XBL matches with SoleChris, GameWizard, and Commonsense.  Forums are slowing down thanks to things like the Facebook group, but I do like the fact that we can have a FAQ on here so we don't get the same questions asked every few weeks.  As for events, possibly set it up similar to SRK and have the upcoming events at the top of the forum.  Then again, like Malik said, no one posts about it. 

Loona:
The topic isn't new, but since it was created after a successful EVO, might as well pick up it again.

On my own reason not to hang out here as much: I'm in Europe, and a lot of info seems USA-centric.
Orochinagi was supposed to cover that, but as of late it has felt a bit off:
* when nothingxs asked for opinions on players here and there, the difference in response was quote in DC's favor.
* The site seems to be losing focus, covering such a variety of games beyond KoF that perhaps neither of them gets covered as well as it could
* the news posts there are getting pretty mixed, covering very different topic under a single title - as if the front page there wasn't turning into a mess lately, finding older stuff isn't very intuitive
* Twitter-wise, there's no distinction between Gunsmith the individual and ON.com the site, so you get a bit of unrelated silliness if you follow that, which would be fine if there was more and better stuff to be found there.

And it pains me to see and state this, because a site and forum that contains topic like thi translation effort and this critical bit of lore should live and thrive.

I'd rather not see DC go through similar troubles - the SNK/KoF scene is already pretty spread out as it is, and if it won't unify in some way, at least it's hubs should aim to be the best they can be.


Taking on the issues covered in the OP:

* Front page

My pet issue with practically every FG site is that it usually has only one blog-like news feed that treats actual news about the games and companies that make them the same way it does community-geneated stuff like tournaments, videos, poscasts, fanart, etc... So you you want to know when something was announced or released, you usually have to dig around the archives under piles of news about tournaments too far away from your area to be relevant to you.
Would it be very hard to have separate columns to separete these different typos of information? It would really be handy for posterity.
I found myself having to create something of the sort on Reddit mostly with plain news, as just about everywhere else it got buried under other stuff or entirely ignored: http://www.reddit.com/r/SNKplaymore

On a more specific note, it should be a bit embarrassing that SRK.com lists the characters used in the KoF finals, even if incompletely, up to top 16, but DC.com lists no characters and stops at top 8.
C'mon guys, is this how you want to be the KoF reference?...


* Other pages
When I check the site, I tend to stick with the front page and forum, but looking about a bit, you guys might want to revise the podcast page to put some dates on those shows - looking at it there's no way to tell how old or recent they are, which may be relevant to put the information in context (post-Climax/Steam? before or after collision box information was revealed?).


* Wiki
Now that collision box information is more accessible, that would be a good adition to the character pages - especially if it start with less-used characters, at least as far as tournament-visibility is concerned. That could encourage a bit more variety, as the predominance of Kim, EX Iori and Mr Karate at EVO does not give a good impression to the outside world.
Also, the wiki's front page's link to Mr Karate says "EX Mr Karate", when technically there's no such thing.


* Forums
There might be more sections than those the forum actually needs or uses - it might not be a bad idea to merge less-used section into more active ones. For example, the whole Tournaments section (which surprisingly contains no updated EVO topic...) into Offline Matchmaking.
That way you spend less time clicking around to find info, and from the outside everything looks a bit more active.


* Community
I can't really comment on the FB situation - I'm not in the group, as my expectation is that everything there is quite US-centric.
Finding out about that When Boys Meet KoF topic here was great though, and the Tumblr mentioned there to point people to was great as well (despite the background pic making it hard to read).
Above I mentioned separate main page columns for actual SNKP news and tournament stuff - maybe that's unlikely to implement, but if it turned out to be doable (each filtered by some tag-based system, for example?...), a 3rd, smaller column for fun stuff like that that also linked to corresponding forum topics would be great.


* Chat
I don't really use that, managing my Twitter feed is already tricky enough (I read everything and everyone I follow, so the volume gets kinda big some times).


I hope this helps, or at least encourages further discussion... I'm far from a good player, but I do love the games, and tend to carry around a stubborn "SNK(P) must live" mantra in my psyche, wondering what to do about that and occasionally putting effort into little things like the Reddit I mentioned above or this topic at NeoGAF, neither of which require deep game knowledge or execution, which others already seem to cover decently.If the tournament scene is what gets them attention, I try and keep up, but there's only so much time and attention I can put into that when so much of it seems to happen so far away.

desmond_kof:

--- Quote from: Loona on July 14, 2014, 03:33:11 PM ---

I'd rather not see DC go through similar troubles - the SNK/KoF scene is already pretty spread out as it is, and if it won't unify in some way, at least it's hubs should aim to be the best they can be.


--- End quote ---

Yeah, honestly, I think Gunsmith is doing a good job running Orochinagi even though it looks like hes trying to make the front page more general fighting game-centric than just only KOF/SNK. It's not a bad idea because the SNK/KOF from time to time can get a little quiet but I will try my best to make sure DC stays KOF/SNK only and catered mainly to players in the USA which was Nilcam's main reason for opening the site.



--- Quote from: Loona on July 14, 2014, 03:33:11 PM ---* Front page


Would it be very hard to have separate columns to separete these different typos of information? It would really be handy for posterity.


--- End quote ---

There is a 'categories' tab on the front page, in the middle of that long column on the right. But if you mean having posts in different columns than just one, that's something I might have to ask the community on their input on if they want that format because myself and others like the blog format.


--- Quote from: Loona on July 14, 2014, 03:33:11 PM ---On a more specific note, it should be a bit embarrassing that SRK.com lists the characters used in the KoF finals, even if incompletely, up to top 16, but DC.com lists no characters and stops at top 8.
C'mon guys, is this how you want to be the KoF reference?...
--- End quote ---

Yeah, I'm going to be honest about that, when it comes to major tournaments, SRK beats us to the punch extremely fast when getting those stats and results from tournaments. I'm not sure how exactly they get those results so fast with the characters and everything, they must have a crew of people watching streams while getting their full results from challonge. I will try to discuss this with the moderators and front page editors on ways we can get those results faster. Most of the time, we just mirror the results from them because they get it so fast. For tournaments that aren't majors, like regionals or local tournaments, we usually get those results first (example, KOFXIII Hyper Battle in Colorado or Tijuana's KOF Challenge II).


--- Quote from: Loona on July 14, 2014, 03:33:11 PM ---* Other pages
When I check the site, I tend to stick with the front page and forum, but looking about a bit, you guys might want to revise the podcast page to put some dates on those shows - looking at it there's no way to tell how old or recent they are, which may be relevant to put the information in context (post-Climax/Steam? before or after collision box information was revealed?).

--- End quote ---

Good idea, I'll add the dates on the podcast page on when they were recorded (or at least published).


--- Quote from: Loona on July 14, 2014, 03:33:11 PM ---* Wiki
Now that collision box information is more accessible, that would be a good adition to the character pages - especially if it start with less-used characters, at least as far as tournament-visibility is concerned. That could encourage a bit more variety, as the predominance of Kim, EX Iori and Mr Karate at EVO does not give a good impression to the outside world.
Also, the wiki's front page's link to Mr Karate says "EX Mr Karate", when technically there's no such thing.

--- End quote ---

We added a few of the hitboxes to the character wiki just as links: http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=NESTS_Kyo_(XIII)#Normals

And I just fixed that EX Mr. Karate typo, thanks man.


--- Quote from: Loona on July 14, 2014, 03:33:11 PM ---* Forums
There might be more sections than those the forum actually needs or uses - it might not be a bad idea to merge less-used section into more active ones. For example, the whole Tournaments section (which surprisingly contains no updated EVO topic...) into Offline Matchmaking.
That way you spend less time clicking around to find info, and from the outside everything looks a bit more active.

--- End quote ---

I might turn the Tournament Results section into a child board from the Upcoming Tournaments section. I'll keep offline matchmaking and the whole tournament section separate because the offline matchmaking is for finding people to play with locally, while the tournaments section is strictly for announcing tournaments. Yeah, most of the EVO discussion either was discussed in the KOFXIII general section or outside of the forum.


--- Quote from: Loona on July 14, 2014, 03:33:11 PM ---* Community
I can't really comment on the FB situation - I'm not in the group, as my expectation is that everything there is quite US-centric.
Finding out about that When Boys Meet KoF topic here was great though, and the Tumblr mentioned there to point people to was great as well (despite the background pic making it hard to read).
Above I mentioned separate main page columns for actual SNKP news and tournament stuff - maybe that's unlikely to implement, but if it turned out to be doable (each filtered by some tag-based system, for example?...), a 3rd, smaller column for fun stuff like that that also linked to corresponding forum topics would be great.
--- End quote ---

If you have an example of that format, link it up for I can see what you mean.



Thanks for your feedback bro!

Loona:

--- Quote from: Desmond Delaghetto on July 15, 2014, 08:12:05 PM ---
--- Quote from: Loona on July 14, 2014, 03:33:11 PM ---* Front page


Would it be very hard to have separate columns to separete these different typos of information? It would really be handy for posterity.


--- End quote ---

There is a 'categories' tab on the front page, in the middle of that long column on the right. But if you mean having posts in different columns than just one, that's something I might have to ask the community on their input on if they want that format because myself and others like the blog format.

--- End quote ---

The Categoried drop-down list is so far down it's kinda of tricky to realize it's even there, which I guess is part of the issue.
Speaking of which, there are still a few things marked as Uncategorized, some of which might fit under Tournament or other existing categories - is it possible to update those after the news have been posted?


--- Quote ---
--- Quote from: Loona on July 14, 2014, 03:33:11 PM ---On a more specific note, it should be a bit embarrassing that SRK.com lists the characters used in the KoF finals, even if incompletely, up to top 16, but DC.com lists no characters and stops at top 8.
C'mon guys, is this how you want to be the KoF reference?...
--- End quote ---

Yeah, I'm going to be honest about that, when it comes to major tournaments, SRK beats us to the punch extremely fast when getting those stats and results from tournaments. I'm not sure how exactly they get those results so fast with the characters and everything, they must have a crew of people watching streams while getting their full results from challonge. I will try to discuss this with the moderators and front page editors on ways we can get those results faster. Most of the time, we just mirror the results from them because they get it so fast. For tournaments that aren't majors, like regionals or local tournaments, we usually get those results first (example, KOFXIII Hyper Battle in Colorado or Tijuana's KOF Challenge II).

--- End quote ---

For something big like EVO where the finals matches are broadcast, it should be viable to have one or more individuals keeping track of results, especially if those are recorded and uploaded later.

Keeping track of that sort of thing, especially with some level of detail, would be kind of cool.
In small tournaments at events I helped to run I drew tables for every match by hand that helped to reconstruct the events of a match: characters used, in which order, which beat which, and markers for perfects and time outs - the notation looked clearer by hand than something I could pull off with a standard digital system, but let me try:

Tokido:EX Iori, Chin (1, 1), Mr Karate (1)Xiaohai:EX Iori (1), Mr Karate, Kim (1)
(well dammit, forum tables don't actually appear as tables with outlines... just imagine each player in his own cell, and each trio of character in its own cell too)

So, this is based on the 1st match here:
Tokido's 1st character is KOed without beating anyone, so he's struck. Same for Xiaohai's Mr Karate.
Xiaohai's 1st character beat a single character, so here he's marked with a (1). Looking at Tokido's character order, clearly it was Iori who was taken down.
Then Tokido's Chin beat Xiaohai's Iori and Mr Karate, so he's marked with "(1, 1)" - I'm not using "(2)", because separating the matches allows for some clarity - had Tokido beated any of those rounds by Perfect or Timeout, I could use a P or T instead of the 1, or even expand the notation with markers like N for NeoMAX or H for Hyper Drive combo, but it's best to keep this simple for now IMO. The 1 could technically be replaced with something like a V for victory, but this isn't set in stone - on paper I have each character in his own table cell, and strike the defeated character with a line coming from the direction of the cell of the character that him him, but this is harder here.
Tokido took the 1st match, so his team for it gets bolded, for the same of clarity - you could add more cells with similar information, and that would allow you to understand the progress of the whole thing, perhaps with a final cell at the end adding it all up, and ultimately the winner of the whole set could get his name bolded too.
Then again, this case involved a reset, so after that there should probably be a separate table.


--- Quote ---
--- Quote from: Loona on July 14, 2014, 03:33:11 PM ---* Community
I can't really comment on the FB situation - I'm not in the group, as my expectation is that everything there is quite US-centric.
Finding out about that When Boys Meet KoF topic here was great though, and the Tumblr mentioned there to point people to was great as well (despite the background pic making it hard to read).
Above I mentioned separate main page columns for actual SNKP news and tournament stuff - maybe that's unlikely to implement, but if it turned out to be doable (each filtered by some tag-based system, for example?...), a 3rd, smaller column for fun stuff like that that also linked to corresponding forum topics would be great.
--- End quote ---

If you have an example of that format, link it up for I can see what you mean.

--- End quote ---

Off the top of my head, the closest I can find is the HG101 front page, which keeps a few highlight on its right side: http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/

Something like a short list of linked titles to articled under the "SNK" category closer to the top might help, for a brief overview of more official news, I guess.


--- Quote ---Thanks for your feedback bro!

--- End quote ---

No problem, let me know if there's anything I can help with.

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