Author Topic: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread  (Read 513618 times)

TYRANNICAL

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #720 on: October 14, 2010, 11:23:40 AM »
Without the ratio system probably it doesn't make sense choose other characters besides K', Raiden and Iori-Liz-Kyo-Kula.
That can be applied to pretty much every KOF.  Why pick anyone but the best?  Seems to be a way of saying the game is MvC2 bad in terms of balance.
KOF XIII:
-K'/EX Kyo/EX Iori
-K'/Andy/Kyo
-Benimaru(Duo Lon)/Robert/Takuma(Iori)

Might controls everything.

Eripio69

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #721 on: October 14, 2010, 11:26:29 AM »
Without the ratio system probably it doesn't make sense choose other characters besides K', Raiden and Iori-Liz-Kyo-Kula.
That can be applied to pretty much every KOF.  Why pick anyone but the best?  Seems to be a way of saying the game is MvC2 bad in terms of balance.

Like MvC2? come on man><

I've seen a deadly Leona and a vice one.. (not reynald). I think most of the people just don't give a chance to the "lower tiers"

Shiranui_ninja

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #722 on: October 14, 2010, 12:04:13 PM »
Without the ratio system probably it doesn't make sense choose other characters besides K', Raiden and Iori-Liz-Kyo-Kula.
That can be applied to pretty much every KOF.  Why pick anyone but the best?  Seems to be a way of saying the game is MvC2 bad in terms of balance.

Like MvC2? come on man><

I've seen a deadly Leona and a vice one.. (not reynald). I think most of the people just don't give a chance to the "lower tiers"

ratios 3-2-1-0 are fair balanced, I think. This ratio thing it's only for limit in some way overpowered teams with both Raiden and K', because if someone choose both of them, you feel obliged to choose them too if you want to win. But if your rival chooses only one of these two, then you have higher chances to beat him with the team you want and participants feel more free to choose who they want. I don't want to seem I want this kind of rule for AI tournament, don't get me wrong. I just thought when I read it that it was an interesting thing to talk about.

TYRANNICAL

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #723 on: October 14, 2010, 12:04:19 PM »
Like MvC2? come on man><

I've seen a deadly Leona and a vice one.. (not reynald). I think most of the people just don't give a chance to the "lower tiers"
The ratio is supposed to promote or rather FORCE players to pick different characters.  This affects even the players who weren't playing the best characters.  If you need this system to force players to pick different characters then it looks bad.  Let's say I just discovered KOF like a week ago.  I stroll up in here and ask:
-"Hey, what's this ratio system about?"
DC member:"To promote playing a variety of characters!  This will show what the other characters are capable of! And it could promote more interest in the game."
-"Oh, that's cool.  So what's stopping them from choosing different characters without the ratio system?  How will the ratio stop them from picking the best combination and rolling with that?"

See that last part?  That's what I want to know.  The standard response to seeing the same powerful characters in any game dominating in a large quantity is usually:"This game is badly balanced."  I don't even think about it's about being afraid to play lower tier characters.   

I'm going to be honest and say that I don't think XIII is horribly balanced.  I expected that some characters would suffer because they can't take advantage of drive cancels and HD combos like some characters can.  I expected that some characters would have better tools than others.  I expected some characters would be a pain in the ass to fight for others.  I fully expected balance issues.  What didn't I expect was that people were not going be "Hey, these characters are better so let's step our shit up and learn how to take them down."

Now there could be a system to restrict team selection instead of promoting overcoming challenges?  I think Raiden's Drop Kick damage is stupid.  I liked that other characters used HD meter+stock to do big damage. I don't know about you, but to me it gives a better impression to see a variety of characters taking down the best characters in the game.  That alone promotes variety and installs confidence into players. 
« Last Edit: October 14, 2010, 12:22:18 PM by TYRANNICAL »
KOF XIII:
-K'/EX Kyo/EX Iori
-K'/Andy/Kyo
-Benimaru(Duo Lon)/Robert/Takuma(Iori)

Might controls everything.

t3h mAsTarOth...!

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #724 on: October 14, 2010, 12:45:06 PM »
It's not the dropkicks alone that's the problem, it's the EX shoulder tackle juggles that makes them ridiculous.
that's fine... if Raiden is spending "meter" to do "damage" then that's perfectly "fair"... why? cause he'll only have 1 drop kick every 12 seconds... and IF it's unsafe like a DP he'll have to gamble with it... or be punished... a large part of "top-tier" character traits are most of their stuff is unnecessarily safe... you take that away and suddenly they don't seem to be whoring moves that much anymore...

btw some of the ratios aren't right at all... vice is not 0... anyways i got nothing to complain about... i got Ralf, Clark, Maxima... 3 points... lol
« Last Edit: October 14, 2010, 01:01:44 PM by t3h mAsTarOth...! »
KOFXIII - Raiden, Billy, Mai, Karate, Kim, Ralf, Ryo, Robert

SC 1-5 - Astaroth

SaMsTarOth t3h mAsTarOth of AsTarOth...!

Zabel

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #725 on: October 14, 2010, 01:05:11 PM »
The ratios don't make sense because it's still way to early for anything like that.

Kane317

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #726 on: October 14, 2010, 01:25:09 PM »
Wait a minute! I saw him remove the entire V1.0 HDD from the board. Does that mean if has another taito X2 laying around we could have 2 KOF XIII running?



I'm assuming they'll make him ship back the first one.

Since the guy knows that you like KOF so much why he didn't order 2 machines from the beginning? I bet he would have made the money for them fast. But since the fiasco of XII I think anyone in his shoes would buy only 1.

How much do you pay per play?

The arcade spent $10K on, one of the SFIV setup the year before that he is losing money on already (on top of losing money to XII).

Started at .50 cents now at .25.

The ratios don't make sense because it's still way to early for anything like that.

Nah it's fine coz you can always modify the ratio as tune progresses. It's not going to change drastically from what you see now. Three months is enough time to get a rough feel for it.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2010, 01:30:18 PM by Kane317 »

Diavle

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #727 on: October 14, 2010, 02:26:05 PM »
Imo the ratio system is a great idea and am glad that AI is looking into it.

It basically brings further balance to an already decently balanced game without banning anyone or any move. No noob to the game will hate you for not kicking the shit out of him with a team of Raiden, K' and Liz or whatever.

Whoring tiers only leads to more whoring, a scenario where there are a few tier users and the other players try to take them down with other characters just doesn't happen.

Like I said earlier, the game is overall pretty balanced so the vast majority of the cast is viable for competitive play, its not like if you pick Raiden or K' you are left with cannon fodder.

Also, since under this system all characters are usable and no one is banned, you will still get to fight every character. As a result you won't lose out on experience fighting whatever character, so even if you show up to a tourney without a ratio system you are still good.

Seriously, if two rooms are being hosted online, one with a ratio system and one without, which one do you think you would have more fun playing in?


The arcade spent $10K on, one of the SFIV setup the year before that he is losing money on already (on top of losing money to XII).

Started at .50 cents now at .25.

Damn, and it was mentioned on Madman's cafe that they are going to sell the arcade edition of SSF4 for over $28K. Crazy stuff.

How has XIII been for him? A success or failure?
« Last Edit: October 14, 2010, 02:31:24 PM by Diavle »

Shiranui_ninja

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #728 on: October 14, 2010, 02:49:10 PM »
anyways i got nothing to complain about... i got Ralf, Clark, Maxima... 3 points... lol

Worst here. I got Mai, King and Mature = 1 point  XDD

Seriously, if two rooms are being hosted online, one with a ratio system and one without, which one do you think you would have more fun playing in?

hmm... difficult to say.

Diavle

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #729 on: October 14, 2010, 02:58:13 PM »
hmm... difficult to say.

A lot depends on the level of play within of course.

Still, the choice for me would be obvious, espcially after fighting the same few characters over and over.

JTSNOW6

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #730 on: October 14, 2010, 03:38:57 PM »
(can not WAIT to see Reynalds' Vice!!)

P.S. I picked up Vice in 98UM with some friends and I am DIGGING HER STYLE!!!!!!

There's already 4-5 clips of Reynald's Vice, did you miss them?  BTW Paul, did you find a place to stay and when you're coming?  If I didn't live with my gf and a roommate I'd offer you a place but it's not really my say. =(

Yeah, I saw those, I guess I meant like I can't wait to see it when shit is on the line (which is only three days away)!!  Dude, thanks for even thinking about it, I ended up staying in town this week but I really appreciate the sentiment!!!!!!

MUSOLINI

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #731 on: October 14, 2010, 05:44:53 PM »
i still say leave raiden like he is. only thing that needs changing is the damage output of those dk's.
In the end, there can only be XIII.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1p0XsEizwHA

Still mo sweet Chariots, keep on swingin'!

solidshark

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #732 on: October 14, 2010, 06:24:36 PM »
The ratio system you guys at AI have planned sounds promising, but a little odd. Promoting or forcing other players being played is a great thing, though I wonder if this will make people get by with the lower tiers instead of immersing them in the characters.  I was kind of hoping someone somewhere in the world to try to do a "who's the best ______ player in the region" using the lesser used characters. Too bad it's a hard thing to expect thanks to tier whorring. But hope that works out for the best over there.
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Zabel

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #733 on: October 14, 2010, 07:24:54 PM »
Imo the ratio system is a great idea and am glad that AI is looking into it.

It basically brings further balance to an already decently balanced game without banning anyone or any move.
No it doesn't, it just means people will play the new Top Tier team that they can in the ratio system.

No noob to the game will hate you for not kicking the shit out of him with a team of Raiden, K' and Liz or whatever.
If you hate you over something like that fuck them. They most likely have no real drive to improve in the first place.

Whoring tiers only leads to more whoring, a scenario where there are a few tier users and the other players try to take them down with other characters just doesn't happen.
Is this the first fighting game you've ever looked into seriously? Holy shit people playing a fighting game serious & Tier Whoring, this is fucking madness.

Like I said earlier, the game is overall pretty balanced so the vast majority of the cast is viable for competitive play, its not like if you pick Raiden or K' you are left with cannon fodder.
Then the ratio system isn't needed at all.

Also, since under this system all characters are usable and no one is banned, you will still get to fight every character. As a result you won't lose out on experience fighting whatever character, so even if you show up to a tourney without a ratio system you are still good.
All characters are already usable and we already do see a varieity of characters in the vids. But you won't see that at all because you're to blinded by Raiden's Dropkicks.

Seriously, if two rooms are being hosted online, one with a ratio system and one without, which one do you think you would have more fun playing in?
The one with the better players, which will most likely be the one without seeing it's mainly scrubs that would whine & want something like a ratio system. Not saying a ratio system can't be fun, but for serious play it's fun. Yes I've changed my mind about Ratio systems after being interested in it during XI.

The ratio system you guys at AI have planned sounds promising, but a little odd. Promoting or forcing other players being played is a great thing, though I wonder if this will make people get by with the lower tiers instead of immersing them in the characters.
YEEEEAAAAAAH fuck the people playing who they want to whether it's tier whoring or not I wanna see people play characters I want

I was kind of hoping someone somewhere in the world to try to do a "who's the best ______ player in the region" using the lesser used characters. Too bad it's a hard thing to expect thanks to tier whorring. But hope that works out for the best over there.
God, I'd usually never link to DG but this time it's warranted seeing how it's specifically about you guys that whine about this stuff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEwGgSA-Zp0
« Last Edit: October 14, 2010, 09:02:58 PM by Kane317 »

THE ANSWER

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Re: The King of Fighters XIII General Discussion Thread
« Reply #734 on: October 14, 2010, 08:31:56 PM »
My God! KOF XIII being compared to MvC2!?!?! one of the most (if not the most) unbalanced games ever made? This has to stop.

@Zabel: I like your straight forward approach.

IMO this point system should not apply to the US at all, I'm sure Japan has hundreds of people playing the game in Tokyo alone so this type of system can work in a way there. We struggle to get 12 players here at AI, I really don't see the point of doing this but I'm down for whatever I will participate for FUN AND KICKS since I don't have the TIME or MONEY to lear 0,1,2 point characters at the moment maybe when console comes out I go to AI once MAYBE twice a week now and that only helps me to brush off the rust of my main team.

« Last Edit: October 14, 2010, 08:35:15 PM by THE ANSWER »
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