KOF XIII 10th General Thread: America on Top (@EVO2013), Everyone Back to Work!

[a11111357]

hey can anyone tell me how the netcode is for that one popular f2p fighting game in china(cant remember the name right now) i heard a rumor that snk might be using the netcode from that game

xdzw?

[PureYeti]

It's fairly positive among the players who play the game. The netcode turn out to be excellent

[desmond_kof]

The netcode to XDZW is great its just that the servers are only in China which gives connections outside of Asia very high pings at times...

[Kane317]

Added some important translation notes to the supposed rumor of the next KOF (from previous page).

[yamazaky96]

-조금 더 유저들이 친근하게 다가갈 수 있도록 시스템을 XIII보다 더 쉽게 할 것이며 모드콤보를 삭제하고 98정도의 콤보로 회귀하는 방향도 검토중.

The system is more user friendly, seems more easier than KOF XIII, and the combo system will be similar to KOF 98 !

easier than KOFXIII.....!!
I will stick to KOF02UM and the classics forever then...

[pablofsi]

XDWZ's netcode is a rollbacks no-input delay based netcode and SNKP is working along with Tencent, they should use it. Some kid at XDWZ's facebook said this:

"When XDZW connection is peer to peer (rollbacks no input delay with practically no frameskipping at a fairly high latency), it's great. Better than pretty much all of the current gen fighters. When it's server based, that's when there's problems, but not because of the netcode, it's because you're connecting to the server."

"Also, for the record, XDZW is BOTH peer to peer AND server based. When you drop enough packets in a match it will switch to server."

It's even better than GGPO... close to Tekken Revolution's netcode (which apparently gives no delay and no warping at 300ms or some shit like that, almost unreal).

They MUST use Tencent's netcode for KOF XIV or it will fail again in forming a robust community.

[desmond_kof]

"When XDZW connection is peer to peer (rollbacks no input delay with practically no frameskipping at a fairly high latency), it's great. Better than pretty much all of the current gen fighters. When it's server based, that's when there's problems, but not because of the netcode, it's because you're connecting to the server."

"Also, for the record, XDZW is BOTH peer to peer AND server based. When you drop enough packets in a match it will switch to server."

It's even better than GGPO... close to Tekken Revolution's netcode (which apparently gives no delay and no warping at 300ms or some shit like that, almost unreal).

Yo, I forgot to mention the peer to peer experiences I had in XDZW. I thought it was really good and it felt extremely nice. The only thing is I felt that maybe it was only good on my side while it was shitty for the Chinese player on the other side, lol. Because of that I felt sort guilty whenever I got a p2p connection, plus the ping counter (which I think was exaggerating and inflated) was in the mid 50ms to 70ms. I remember trying to find out ways to bypass the server and make all p2p connections possible (opening ports) but I couldn't a way.

I do agree; if SNKP is working with input delay again, they are going to be making the same mistake as last time.

[pablofsi]

Obviously I don't expect this game (SE) to have anything close to rollbacks.

[Reiki.Kito]

So, since it's getting close to Monday in Japan, is SNK going to reveal the beta testers? Or are they doing it based on another timezone, like America?

[pablofsi]

It's sunday, they don't work today.

[Reiki.Kito]

Technically, it's 4:34 AM in Tokyo right now.

[Kane317]

They still wouldn't work that early. 

[Mr Bakaboy]

easier than KOFXIII.....!!
I will stick to KOF02UM and the classics forever then...

Actually my bet is this is what you want. Doing the combo system like KOF XIII is brutal on any kind of lag whatsoever. The idea being one false move and you get most of your life taken away. Easier probably means they will simplify the game system by dialing down the combos since the example was KOF '98. Less combos means less complaints that the netcode isn't perfect. I'm surprised they didn't mention KOF '02 or KOF XI in keeping at least some of the system intact, but I guess KOF XIII system has been too many headaches for them.

[Dandy J]

Yea it kind of depends on what they mean by easy. In a lot of ways, KOF13 is harder than any other kof, because you HAVE to learn the hard stuff (hd combos, optimal combos in general) to compete. It has this pseudo anime game feeling to it that it never really had before because of that. So even though you can look at 2k2um or original 02, where the maxmode combos are way more difficult to execute and say that they're harder, you can also play those games based on fundamentals and be much more successful than you would in kof13. There's characters that don't even really use max mode, well all know that. In kof13 as time went on, very few characters without strong or practical hd usage were relevant because of the nature of the game.

So yea, 2k2um max mode is hard, but you can play k' and just run around playing normally and only do short short trigger~spike, overhead~minute spike, and basic launch combos in the corner and win just fine. You can zone and poke with 2k2um King, do basic prox ub/attack option selects and not even do combos and be successful. So is it really harder overall? I'd say it's based more upon the neutral game than landing mixups and combo starters, whether that's easier or harder is not really explaining the entire situation. If I was to teach someone with crappy execution but good decision making and intelligence in fighting games a kof, kof13 would be the most frustrating one for them to learn, because you can't play without the combo grind. They forced it on everyone in a way they never did before. Yet a small child could play 98 ralf, oyashiro, chris, daimon, etc. on a basic level. And then depending on your point of view you could turn right around and say that kof98 is a harder game.

And don't forget, there's neanderthals out there with great execution too, and mvc3 increased their numbers by quite a lot. I've seen them! Those kinds of players would be comparatively stronger in kof13 just because they would instantly be able to convert stuff into damage, since hd combos really are not hard at all for the most part IF you have good execution. They are just made that way. Yet in an older kof (which are way harder right?), they would not even really have an outlet because the games are based almost completely on the neutral game and not on confirming into big combos. So it depends on what you mean by easier and harder.

Having parts of the game being easier (like combos), just brings out other parts of the game (neutral), which in turn changes the nature of the game. When it comes down to it, making the game more basic in terms of combos would both increase the importance of the neutral game, spacing, poking, etc., and decrease the importance of grinding combos off short short~activate or trying to land that one cross up. Harder or easier? Does it matter? The game would be both easier for new players to pick up, especially from sf4 (which is where most of the intelligent ones are anyway), and favor more experienced, intelligent players at the same time. Sounds like a win/win to me.

[pablofsi]

Actually things haven't changed much from my point of view. 2002's combos aren't harder to pull off. The difference is that maxmode combos are to a point nerfed in XIII because of the accurate damage scaling. You could do a lot of stuff in 2002 that gave you excellent results with one or two bars. Here you have to work a lot more to pull off something like that. Thus, from my perspective XIII's combos aren't really mandatory because they are a little less powerful than before. Bnb combos work like they always have.

Yashiro in 2002 can totally rape noobs in the arcade with one bar each round. Just an example.

I play XIII offline with my group of friends just fine without lengthy combos, just bnbs.

Imo I think the problem is that with XIII, and coming from 2002 long combos have been made much more of a standard. The bar has been raised. You could see people using long combos in arcades where I live but I'd watch videos online of 2002 versus matches and I'd see almost none. It's just much more common for your average joe now (and XIII has more possibilities, so it encourages you more to learn them, or allows you to have slightly different versions of combos or choose from 2, 3 main ones and that gives more variety and thus, encourages and makes them more common).

You can see the effect in 2002 UM where max mode high damage combos now are also a pretty definitive common factor in matches.