NGBC General Discussion thread

[Remzi]

According to what I know, you can j.2D loop with Mai after a 236236A/C. You can do this many times, but it's extremely tight if you want more than two, as you need to do j.2D the very frame you leave the ground. In corner, start it off with 6B (1 hit) 236236A j.2D j.2D j.2D j.2D j.2D etc. 6B is also pretty good on wakeup, considering it's safe and it's two hit, so GCFS is semi-unsafe, plus you can cancel it into her meter if they do GCFS. :3
You can get an instant overhead into meter by doing an instant j.B into her 236236A.
Cancels from 5C 3B are very good, you can cancel into her super-deadly bees midscreen and in corner you can go for 214C -> super-deadly bees and also into her DA.

Edit : I've been editing my site lots, updating to new software. Actually deleted the old wiki software, so I'll back this up here. It'll be back on my site once some other stuff is updated, though.

Backwards Throws
Asura - Archangel
Kaede - Regular Throw
Washizuka - Regular Throw
Kim Kaphwan - Regular Throw
Kyo - Regular Throw
Mai Shiranui - Regular Throw
Mr. Karate - Regular Throw
Robert Garcia - Regular Throw
Rock Howard - Regular Throw
Shermie: - Busty Suplex, Shermie Spiral, Shermie Clutch, Shermie Whip
Terry - Regular Throw
Yuki - Fire Suplex Hold

[jinxhand]

Yeah Tung I think builds meter even faster than Marco, and I know he can just throw stuff out and build meter...


How do the Mexican players feel about NGBC??? Is it solid enough to them for tournament play, or is it just something to play to kill time???

Just to kill time, I'm trying to get Kula to play it seriously that way I can have some solid competition...

I can't wait to see what you guys can come up with in your battles.

You can get an instant overhead into meter by doing an instant j.B into her 236236A.

You should be able to tiger knee that while doing , since I don't think she has any air specials using (or for that matter). I know some characters can do certain moves using the tiger knee method, so she should be one of them.

[Remzi]

You can buffer TK her j.236236A/C with 2362369A/C.
Her j.B can also link into her j.2D to make it even safer.

Ryo can link his 2B into his 2C. In corner this has practical uses such as 2B 2C 236A, and midscreeen / corner it has uses such as 2B 2C 63214A -> DM

[jinxhand]

Ryo's link connects anywhere in screen. His strongest meterless combo is:

, , ,

I have to buffer in the in order to get it to connect. Once the timing is down with this combo, you can start ending matches quickly. His link to is still good though, and from the link, you can do mixups, especially with his throw, which if done in the corner allows for a free OTG / .

Oh yeah, Geese can TK his Shippuken, Dio can TK his Meteor Smash, Yuki can TK his air dash special, and Robert can TK his air / . Robert's TK kinda sucks though, because of the delay in the move, but it allows you to charge for a flash kick with .

[Remzi]

The 16B won't connect midscreen or in corner. It's stronger in corner because of the meterless 236A after the 2C.

[jinxhand]

The 16B won't connect midscreen or in corner. It's stronger in corner because of the meterless 236A after the 2C.

If close it can connect midscreen... It's very range dependent. I never try doing those combos at standing range; I always go in, since he has the (?) counter and if you anticipate a reversal or something similar, you can readily throw that out, and punish accordingly.

EDIT: I just tested the 2B, 2C, 214A, 16B combo out, and it all connects as a 4 hit combo. (http://youtu.be/zBWyjd5LHsI) The 16B normally does 2 hits, but in the combo, it only does 1. It's still stronger than the regular BnB combo, and it allows Ryo to put the opponent in the corner...

[Remzi]

Oh wow, that's extremely tight and you need seriously close spacing. Still nice to see it actually working though.

Also, Ryo has a double-OTG after his sweep. Use 2D 623B 623B. It does seriously good damage for a sweep, plus 2D and 623B are fine mixups.

[jinxhand]

Oh wow, that's extremely tight and you need seriously close spacing. Still nice to see it actually working though.

You need close spacing to do his bnb combo normally. In the vid, I was showing the range that to needs to be in order to connect it and how far he needs to be to whiff it. There are some instances where will hit, and will whiff completely.

[Remzi]

Yeah, the spacing is close. Just because execution, I definitely prefer 2BC 16D.

Found out Moriya has some really weird tricks to him too. 2D can be cancel'd into a bunch of things including his teleport and 623C to change sides with them. You cannot OTG after it without a bluecancel or in corner.
You can make his 214 moves safe by hitting the button again and then getting out of that stance by hitting D. You can also repeat the move again via re-standby as much as you want.
His 2B is gdlk, you can combo out of it for easy damage. You cannot OTG after a third 2B, though. 2BB 236A 236A 236A 5B, or you can do 2BB 236A 236A 2363214C. His parries are super-tight on frames, they're also seriously dangerous. Try to avoid them unless they're doing really obvious stuff. Same as Kaede, you can SC the moves into his d-assault. 6 parry is for high and mid, 4 parry is for mid and low. You can use 3C to OTG an enemy twice on the ground when you throw them into corner. aside from that, there aren't many things that will allow use of that move in a game. Save for his lv2, his lv1 is only good for resetting pressure.

Edit : Found out more stupid Moriya stuff. He's most like his Power counterpart. Akari is probably the only Speed character in NGBC. Maybe Washizuka, but I'm pretty sure he's mostly like power.
Anyways, Moriya probably has his teleport combos although I don't actually know how to do them in LB2. Just like in LB2, you can use his 5B and cancel into teleport to start some mixups / confusion. There is no teleport glitch in this game, be careful about that. If you want to use him in NGBC, though, I suggest picking up LB2. After all, he still has the strong spacing and whatnot (j.A, j.C, 2A). His 623C can link into 5A if it crosses through them, allowing you to cancel that into a shitton of mixups as well. I'm going to try to find out how Japan combos into the ADA so easily, for some stupid reason I can't find a video including his ADA.

Edit 2 : There's a shitton of methods to combo into ADA if you really look for them, his best is probably off 2BB / 2A. I also found out this little combo : 2A 236A 236A 623C 5A 236A (whiff) 236A (whiff) 236A It's corner-only, but it's really stylin' and provides position to 5B -> Teleport cancel -> Do a mixup into an ADA combo. You can replace the 5A in the combo with his ADA for even more stylin'.

[Remzi]

Marco punishment combo is 5D [BD] 3D 236236[AC]
It's extremely hard but yeah, it's very effective.
He has a dash-in grab semi-mixup with his light grenade at mid-range. Throw his light grenade, run in and attempt to grab them. They'll normally think it's a grab and attempt to tech until they get smarter. This totally fakes them out and forces them to get hit by the grenade safely. Even on block, it's very safe, and if you time it correctly you can actually run-in and grab.
Safe approach with Marco would be heavy grenade -> jetpack (jumping or on ground, jumping is a bit safer)
You can make an unblockable with a light iron-lizard and j.C by delaying the jump just enough so that j.C will hit about the same time that the iron lizard does. Techically it's blockable, although it would be extremely hard and it would take a good read of which one comes first.

Marco taught me a lot, actually. The game has similar crossup protection as Melty Blood. Fuck yeah, another reason I love them both. I tested this by doing Marco's lizard and crossed up with j.D, you only have to block away from the enemy and not where the projectile came from (like it should be. Ahem, aegis reflector unblockable.)

[Dark Geese]

FYI since I am going to hopefully doing some NGBC battles at Sanji's Birthday Bash this weekend, just FYI more stuff about Big that people don't explore enough as an Anti Air:

Dp+A (both sides he has are covered as an anti air)
-Neutral Jump A (The best one for sure if Lariat doesn't work, has the best priority/speed even better than Lariat!!!)
-forward jump b (A good one for jumping in)
-Light punch/A Torpedo (YES it does work as an anti air)
-Neutral jump C (you have to know when to use this one)
-Neutral Jump D( Very fast, not as fast as neutral Jump A, but does more damage.

These are just some food for thought and some things I will be testing out further this Saturday.

[jinxhand]

FYI since I am going to hopefully doing some NGBC battles at Sanji's Birthday Bash this weekend, just FYI more stuff about Big that people don't explore enough as an Anti Air:

Dp+A (both sides he has are covered as an anti air)
-Neutral Jump A (The best one for sure if Lariat doesn't work, has the best priority/speed even better than Lariat!!!)
-forward jump b (A good one for jumping in)
-Light punch/A Torpedo (YES it does work as an anti air)
-Neutral jump C (you have to know when to use this one)
-Neutral Jump D( Very fast, not as fast as neutral Jump A, but does more damage.

These are just some food for thought and some things I will be testing out further this Saturday.

I tend to not use 623A only because it has a tendancy to whiff sometimes. Maybe I jump the gun, I' m not sure... Standing A as an AA seems like the good ole KOF strat how sometimes 5A can beat out a jump attack.

I need to see if Lariat can beat out Ryo's 623A/C (or trade in favor of Big). I haven't gone really in-depth with Big in awhile, and I want to find out some things. I definitely want to know what can be done with 9C since it hits twice a la Dictator. I also need to figure out property changes with moves on counter hit, to see if things that normally can't combo will do so like Lee's 2C xx 236236A.

Anyway, speaking of Marco, and after last Sunday's NGBC Session+other matches, I'm definitely convinced Mudman is Marco's worst matchup. The only thing Marco has over Mudman is that his grenades go through Mudman's projectiles, but can still trade in favor of Mudman, since will have enough time to dodge the grenade accordingly. 3C works wonders against Marco. You definitely need to bait those air dashes with Marco, or even better, throw out that UFO beam. Marco won't be able to block it since he would be air dashing with his special. Mudman has better wake up options with 236236K and the beam super. Mudman would just have to dodge quite a bit if he gets knocked down, since most Marcos tend to run away and start throwing grenades out. Up close, Marco can't do too much, unless he's in knife stance, which he won't have time to go into because Mudman should be rushing with those diving knees, and mixing up.

[Dark Geese]

See Jinxhand thats what I was saying..pick Marco and Hotaru and now you see why I choose Mudman if people choose Hotaru and/or Marco. Too hard for Marco to do anything if he gets corned....Also man Tung is very very close next to Mudman.

Tung may be Marcos worst matchup with Mudman right next to it. Tung can run UNDER grenades....

[jinxhand]

See Jinxhand thats what I was saying..pick Marco and Hotaru and now you see why I choose Mudman if people choose Hotaru and/or Marco. Too hard for Marco to do anything if he gets corned....Also man Tung is very very close next to Mudman.

Tung may be Marcos worst matchup with Mudman right next to it. Tung can run UNDER grenades....

Seems like that's the only thing Tung can do that Mudman can't though, and that's only for the high grenades... Well, Tung can also use air which can cover some ground, but at a certain range, even EX dash punch can only help out in certain situations.

I think Mudman can do slightly better that Tung, only because he can trade more often, and in some cases, he can hit Marco from long range, and have enough time to block if the right projectile was used, especially into his super. Not only that, but once Mudman gets 2 stocks, Marco's gotta respect that level 2 super. Marco can't even air dash past it, thus ultimately changing the pace of the game in favor of Mudman.

The hitbox for Tung's ~ doesn't extend far enough to pose as much of a threat as it should. There have been times where a character was literally standing a little bit into the tip of the projectile, where it overlapped the opponent's character, and he still didn't get hit. It's still a great projectile imo, it just doesn't help Tung the way it should vs zoning characters, mostly Marco. That doesn't mean Tung can't give Marco a hard time. It's just that I think they equally have a hard time, one with rushing, and the other with zoning.

Mudman can't really outzone Marco, but I feel he has an easier time to close in on him, especially with that slide -n- bait tactic.

As for Hotaru, well. I think that's not too easy for Mudman (but he can still win), but easier for Tung. Hotaru's projectile can be beaten with EX dash punch. Hotaru's gonna want to close in, because that's where she shines, so one wrong move on Hotaru's part, and its Muscle Maaaaaaaaaaan!!! So yeah, even with Mudman's zoning abilities, he's gonna have to be careful up close, simply because he can't do too much against her. He does have the knee dive, but with her dp being pretty decent, he's gonna have to bait with a super jump to his hover move, and kinda play things by sight...

Even after all of that, I do feel that Tung is overall stronger than Mudman, and that's merely because Mudman doesn't have any really strong combos per sé. Outside of MuscleMan, EX combos and 236236P, Tung would probably be weaker than Mudman.

[Zabel]

HOw do you feel about Nakorur and Cyber Woo? BEen thinking about giving those two a twirl.