The Virtua Figher 5 thread: just 6 months before the end of the world

[solidshark]

Virtua Fighter 5 Final Showdown Version A - the other fighting game I can barely wait for a console release for.

KoF XIII better be first, but hopefully this sometime soon after.

[sibarraz]

Considering that SEGA has trolled us hard since VF5 Revision D : (

Lol, there has been lots of VF5 since version C : ( Want to play with taka arashi dammit

[Xxenace]

Considering that SEGA has trolled us hard since VF5 Revision D : (

Lol, there has been lots of VF5 since version C : ( Want to play with taka arashi dammit

lolsumoswrestlers

[The Fluke]

Oh if there was just an updated version available for consoles with an added online mode.. The rest seems pretty much perfect to me. beyond everything else that is good about the game, the storyline in VF5 is fantastic!

[jinxhand]

Sega waited til version B for console release for the ps3, then version C for x360... Here's hoping that if they do decide to release a future version B for console that it can be "upgradable" unlike the rushed ps3 version...

VF5R was more complete than 5FS imo... It had more of a "Dark Resurrection" feel to it but I do like 5FS' combo system and how you're easily punishable for running away... Jeffry's been crazy nerfed though...

[quash]

i like the removal of 0f throw and throw clash, myself.

[jinxhand]

i like the removal of 0f throw and throw clash, myself.

Yeah throw clash seemed too much of a "get out of jail" card for people who spammed everything but the kitchen sink...

[Shinra Shiranui]

I never played to much of virtua Fighter but i heard there was one with a really good training mode so i was wondering if their going to put that same system in this one?

[jinxhand]

I never played to much of virtua Fighter but i heard there was one with a really good training mode so i was wondering if their going to put that same system in this one?

So many people have been requesting that training mode from VF4Evo (ps2 release I recommend getting if anyone wants to learn the basics)... Here's hoping that if it does get released it comes well equipped with tons of features...

[jinxhand]

Not a fan of bumping old threads, but since this is the only VF thread, oh well...

I've been getting a few questions regarding VF and have heard people say a few things about the game... As some of you cats might know, I used to main this heavily, and I still do go hard for this game, but I do the same for SNK games as well with the same tenacity... Anyway, I figured I'll break some questions/thoughts/ideas/misconceptions down here with VF5 as the main reference, because well, that's the latest one we can get our hands on for console:

1. VF is deep/hard/some other adjective that can be used as a euphemism:
 
    * VF in general is considered a game that's very deep. In many aspects, yes it is deep. It's very frame heavy, meaning that there are setups and situations that depending on the frame advantage (or disadvantage) you can/can't do certain moves to get out of a setup, or in some cases capitalize on a situation. But there are other things in this game that are similar to others like Tekken, Soul Calibur, and even DOA. For instance, there are specific punishing moves. In Tekken, you have jab punishers, launch punishers (and those vary depending on the frame adv/disadv), specific non-launcher move punishers (these are mainly knockdown moves and also frame dependent) and throw punishers. VF is the exact same thing... It has all of these types of punishers, and some jab punishers vary as well. For those that say the game is hard, I look at it like this: the game only has 3 buttons!!! This is half of the buttons that are used in SF, 1 less than Tekken/Soul Calibur/KOF, and about the same as DOA/WHP. Granted, the number of buttons doesn't always mean that there's a low learning curve, but it does help imo.

Real talk, if you can do Hayate's throw in DOA, EWGF x 4+ in Tekken, parry like a madman in 3S, or any other "difficult" move requiring execution, you can play VF... On the flipside to that, if all you do is j.Roundhouse to cr.Roundhouse with Ryu in every SF, or df+3, ws+3 and nothing else with Bryan in Tekken, just hit confirm Terry's cl. to connect a super, or if you can't do any of the crap I just mentioned, you can play VF... It's not as hard as people make it out to be. It really depends on how willing you are to learn the game, and how willing you are to step up on your execution, thought process (are you gonna knock those bad habits of not using the best punishers, or strong combos, single flowcharts, etc.). Sure, you can play the game without really learning much on frames, as you can look at the moves just like in Tekken and get a good idea of what to punish and poke with based on animation alone, but if you wanna become really competitive, then you're gonna wanna know something about frame data... And as far as throw breaks (TE - throw escapes) go, well even the best of the best don't even input all options, maybe 1 or 2 at best. It's not something to really worry much about. There are popular or most used throws that specific characters use, and the most are 3, so you can practice those, level up in matches, and from there you'll start to see how TE works, and can incorporate it in other concepts like ETE and ETEG (don't fret!!!)...

Also, there are also characters (if you played or saw the character select in the original VF4 you'll definitely know what I'm talking about) that can be rated based on difficulty or their "learning curve", and they can translate over to VF5 in some ways. There are also what I call "entry-level" characters who are the easy to learn, hard to master type characters. Akira is a good example of this. He requires you to know the basics of the game, and can help you with things like buffering, frames, nitaku, reverse nitaku, oki, etc... You also have characters who seem easy because of their inputs (i.e.- Jeffry, Lion), but because of their lack of defensive options, or low damage output, they require you to put some thought or pizzaz into the character to really make them shine. That isn't to say that they're "weak" or "low tier", because in some sense the game is pretty balanced, which I will explain next.

2. VF is balanced:

   * VF is indeed balanaced. It's not perfect, but its to the point that you can be competitive with any character. There technically is a "tier list" but even in that one of the best players in VF (look up Chibita and VF) uses Lion, who is considered weak in VF5, so what does that tell you? You can go JWong and pick up either Pai, or Lei Fei, who are considered the strongest this time around, but you're still fair game to anybody, even if you put a bunch of time in learning these characters, because everyone has the tools to compete... There are matchups, but there really isn't any "counter picking" unless you decide to pick the strongest character, which even at that point as I explained before doesn't always work, because just as you know they're strong, other players know about that character and has studied up on them and found weaknesses and formed strats that work against said character(s).

Now every game isn't with some discrepancies... My beef with VF in general are the ground to air hitboxes. What I mean is, VF in general is grounded game, so you won't necessarily see many characters use aerial moves unless its a down attack, Kage's knee, and a few other select moves. This can be exploited in some cases, especially online, but I've witness this offline on many occassions. I main Jeffry, so its expected that whoever I fight is gonna get a knee launcher (forward+kick) at least 2-3 times a round if possible. Now granted, Jeffry isn't too far from the ground, but he should be far enough to avoid a sweep. There have been times in where I've been hit out of the air with a low attack that wasn't considered a special mid, beit a low sweep, a low kick, or some other move that's low. However, it seems that VF5FS might have fixed this, especially given the fact that jumps are higher and faster or more natural feeling(?), but I'm not in Japan, so I can't test this. Sega does a pretty good job at balancing characters in terms of damage output, moves and their properties. They should (and probably have) need to work more on the other things within the game that don't necessarily seem like "glitches" directly, but can cause a problem during gameplay although its not really "gamebreaking"...

3. VF is looks the same as it did in '92:

    * I guess that's personal preference... In all honesty, the graphics for VF can still compete imo with Tekken 6, and other 3d fighters. When you fight on a wet stage and get wet, your apparel will show that. Windy stages display how articles of clothing would flow, and it looks just as real. I will admit though, that the characters can look like action figures at times, but for the most part, Sega's got the graphic appeal down, although its not as flashy until you say, customize your character. The stages are pretty solid too imo. I know this "looking the same" reference is primarily used in reference to the character's animation, but you know what? Alot of the moves in VF have been altered in animation since VF2- that can proven. There are some moves, however that you just really can't change, like a standing punch, especially if its supposed to be based on a real fighting style... I don't see Muay Thai practicioners changing their single jab after 10 years of practicing, right? Same goes for some moves in VF, or even Soul Calibur. Stairstepping in Tekken has looked the same since T3, and there were alot of clone characters that didn't really get distinguished til TTT (I know because I'm a Tekken head- maybe not so much for T6, but I'm still a threat j/k). Capcom has kept the same animations for alot of their characters, especially Ryu. But does that mean he's rejected as a character?? Not at all... He in fact is one of the most popular (as in heavily used in arcades/consoles) characters in SF with the same moves, the only "new" moves he got was the donkey kick and the fake hadoken (both from different SF iterations). I'll let this one go, simply because as with people that bash other games, they don't play them, and/or they're afraid of competition, so they bash it so that others agree and keep other people from trying something else out (that, too is for another discussion)...

4. VF isn't popular:

    * Yeah, its not as popular in the states, or everywhere else that isn't Japan, except for China and maybe Korea. I feel alot of this is due to poor advertising, and the misconceptions that came with VF (too hard, stiff animation, etc)... I'll say that during certain times of VF, especially VF2 and VF4, it was readily available in many parts of the world, but the popularity wasn't as strong as TTT or 3S. However, with all the hype over VF5FS possibly being released, and with all the fans making requests, who knows how this can work out for Sega, if they even release it at all. It could screw them over because they waited so long and haven't said anything to the public about anything VF related, or it could benefit them because they actually did listen to the fans (without responding), and served them well with something that can give the other 3d fighters a run for their money, especially by balancing it for both newcomers and hardcore players alike... Either way, I'm still crushing (and getting crushed) in whatever VF we have available.

Well, I'm done for now, I can't think of any other questions/thoughts/etc. Sorry for the long schpiel, but I figured a bunch of cats are asking the same questions, I might as well answer them from my perspective. I'm not the guru of VF, as there's still much I've to learn, but I'm willing to help cats out in this and any other fighter for that matter without being an elitist (that's what commUNITY is all about!!! Learn as much, and share even more)... I'm available to answer questions pertaining to VF as well as other Sega fighters like Fighting Vipers, Last Bronx, etc (but if let's try to keep this thread strictly VF for now)... Man I go way back like Guardian Heroes and Eternal Champions, so if you wanna hit me up on that, I'm here...

And if anyone is interested in VF and has either a PS2/3 or X360, get VF4:Evolution for PS2 (its dirt cheap now), and check out the tutorial, as all of the info in it can be applied to VF5, and the only things to really learn in VF5 would be OM(offensive movement), clashing, 0-frame throws (a throwback from VF3), and I believe that's it (don't quote me on it though). VF5 is available for both PS3 and X360, but the PS3 version is ver.B, whereas X360's is ver.C. I'll list the changes on this thread eventually...

[solidshark]

You might have me playing an old VF game soon Jinx. Thanks for highlighting why VF is so great.

[Ashspiralingblood]

Vitua fighters mechanics are pretty easy to learn, but there is so much too learn, too bad its not presented in the right way

[sibarraz]

We bitch that SNKP is taking so long to announce KOF XIII for consoles?

Imagine the feeling of NA VF fans who must be waiting like 4 years for a hinting that maybe a new rev of VF will appear on consoles

[jinxhand]

You might have me playing an old VF game soon Jinx. Thanks for highlighting why VF is so great.

Thanks... It's really a 3d version of KOF, and I know some people don't see it that way, but they're both equally deep and rewarding, with skill being the true factor of a win, and not tier whoring, or some other tactic (yes even against Kusanagi, Shameless, and Kula and other stronger chars in 2k2UM)...

We bitch that SNKP is taking so long to announce KOF XIII for consoles?

Imagine the feeling of NA VF fans who must be waiting like 4 years for a hinting that maybe a new rev of VF will appear on consoles

You know I've stopped sweating over XIII to be honest... Same with VF5FS... We have good games already, why bother with complaints??? ST fans and 3S fans still been playing them hardcore before SF4 was even thought of development, way before petitions, and all the other things that could have made SF4 a reality... Why can't we do the same for both KOF and VF??? They can be just as appealing and flashy and rewarding to both hardcore and casual players alike, it just needs exposure-- ALOT of exposure... And I'm sorry, JWong playing KOF/NGBC/whatever isn't gonna do it... Ryan Hart playing it isn't gonna do it... We need a bunch of high level cats from all fighting venues, especially SNK-only cats, to showcase why KOF is good, and VF as well... This goes for other FG scenes of games that don't get much exposure, like JJBA, FHD, Breakers Revenge, Samsho, FF, etc...

[sibarraz]

Want further proof that the world is ending the 2012?

There you had