Dream Cancel Forum
King of Fighters XIII => Character Discussion => Vice => Topic started by: nilcam on December 06, 2011, 06:12:30 AM
-
(http://i1005.photobucket.com/albums/af171/dreamcancel/kofxiii/vice.gif)
Notation
;a = Light Punch
;b = Light Kick
;c = Strong Punch
;d = Strong Kick
* = EX version possible
Throws
Death Blow - ;bk / ;fd+ ;c / ;d
Command Normals
Dokken - ;fd + ;a
Special Moves
Splash - ;dp + ;a / ;c *
Mayhem - ;qcb + ;a / ;c
∟;qcf + ;a / ;c (Splash - EX only) *
Deicide - ;hcf + ;b / ;d *
GoreFest - ;hcb ;fd + ;a / ;c *
Desperation Moves
Negative Gain - ;hcb x2 + ;b / ;d *
Overkill - ;db ;dn ;df ;fd ;uf ;up ;dn + ;a / ;c (in air)
Neomax
Awakening Blood - ;qcb ;hcf + ;a ;c
Vice's Wiki entry (http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=Vice_(XIII)).
Console changes:
- (shown in video) Strong version of Mayhem has le
ss lag. If you hit with the edge of it you can do a strong attack as a followup.
- (shown in video) Added a new chain combo D -> D. Only cancellable in HD mode.
- jump CD is faster.
- (shown in video) EX Mayhem has faster startup.
- (shown in video) Strong version of Decide can be comboed into the Strong version of Mayhem.
- EX Deicide has less lag and is easier to followup with normal attacks.
- (shown in video) Splash (including the followup version) can be super cancelled into Overkill AFTER it hits.
- (shown in video) Overkill can be MAX Cancelled.
- Overkill’s command has been made easier. If the last input is in any downward direction it will register.
- Damage adjustments:
* Her f+A (when cancelled) does 45 damage (down from 70)
* Her Overkill does 200 damage (down from 220)
* Her EX Mayhem does 120 damage (down from 160)
Producer Yamamoto says: She’s received a number of damage nerfs, but in exchange she has a lot more combo opportunities making the nerfs not so noticeable. Her air game has especially improved with her jump CD, EX Decide can be used afterwards to follow up.
-
Juicy Bits - KOF13 Character Basics: Vice (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSXugUjN30o#ws)
-
Reserved
-
hmm k I just started using Vice not too long ago and have a few questions:
- Best pokes? I've been using c.B, s.C, CD and deicide, and occasional max range Mayhem works sometimes as well but against some characters thats just asking for pain.
-what do u anti-air with? EX deicide works at a distance and hop D is ok against telegraphed shit, but what if theyre jumping at me? is there something i can do or is blocking my only option?
-whats some good blockstrings to use?
-some non-meter consuming followups for EX Deicide (i know u can do s.D f.A xx Mayhem then jab EX deicide)?
best followup for D deicide?
can you combo into D deicide (outside of mayhem DC)?
can you combo anything out of B deicide (other than Gorefest and her Grab DM)?
-whats the difference between regular and EX Gorefest? just more damage? can u combo out of the EX?
-how do u guys utilize Splash or is it useless outside of punishing bad fireballs? i'm thinking there's a way to use it mid-blockstrings or as a reset mid-combos but idk how to set it up (if it is possible).
- Any advice for a new Vice player ^^ ?
-
Can we get a list of Vice players and their footage? Im Curious to see the different playstyles for her
-
hmm k I just started using Vice not too long ago and have a few questions:
- Best pokes? I've been using c.B, s.C, CD and deicide, and occasional max range Mayhem works sometimes as well but against some characters thats just asking for pain.
-what do u anti-air with? EX deicide works at a distance and hop D is ok against telegraphed shit, but what if theyre jumping at me? is there something i can do or is blocking my only option?
I'm not much of a Vice player, but based only on my experience fighting her, I highly recommend j.CD as both an AA and a poke. It has amazing speed and range. It beats just about anything I've ever tried against it.
-whats some good blockstrings to use?
I think ending a blockstring with B Deicide is your safest option.
-some non-meter consuming followups for EX Deicide (i know u can do s.D f.A xx Mayhem then jab EX deicide)?
best followup for D deicide?
can you combo into D deicide (outside of mayhem DC)?
can you combo anything out of B deicide (other than Gorefest and her Grab DM)?
B Deicide is only +1 on block (I think), so the only possible follow-ups are one-frame grabs like Gorefest and her DM.
D Deicide can be followed up with Mayhem, but it's too slow to combo into outside of DCs.
EX Deicide can be followed up with normals.
And I believe her most damaging non-meter combo is cl.D, f+A, qcb+C -> qcf+P.
-whats the difference between regular and EX Gorefest? just more damage? can u combo out of the EX?
Just more damage and range. Some moves that are normally "safe" against Vice's grabs because of the pushback can be punished with the EX version.
-
- Best pokes? I've been using c.B, s.C, CD and deicide, and occasional max range Mayhem works sometimes as well but against some characters thats just asking for pain.
Stand B is a good one as well, long range, and can combo into A Mayhem at full range (which is suprising), or even Gorefest, if you're slightly close. Especially the EX version.
Random Note: Remember, she can get EX Deicide off Crouch D sweep. So keep that in mind! Especially since she's one of those people who cannot cancel her far D or C into anything...
-what do u anti-air with?
Neutral Hop/Jump D and B are OK too, since the attack box is so far away from her body. Her close D also does a good job for people trying to jump ofer you, as she has her leg kicked almost straight up at one point. It's not the best AA, but it's actually better than I'd initially expect.
Oh yeah, and there's Overkill. Good if you can predict their movement!
-whats the difference between regular and EX Gorefest? just more damage? can u combo out of the EX?
EX Gorefest has some of the greatest grab range in the game. You won't see it used often because people would generally wanna save her meter for those Deicides, but if you have the reaction for it, you can catch people unaware from much further than they'd expect. You can grab them from the full range of a crouch B, and almost full range of a stand B, for 196 damage. For that kinda range and damage, it's like a nice Mini DM, and sets up a good closer-to-corner knockdown situation for you.
-how do u guys utilize Splash or is it useless outside of punishing bad fireballs? i'm thinking there's a way to use it mid-blockstrings or as a reset mid-combos but idk how to set it up (if it is possible).
EX Splash is stupid-fast. If a person stays on the ground for any amount of time after it starts up, they've now been slammed. It's a little under half screen range, but remember, it can be super-canceled into Overkill, for a very solid, EXDM-like 340 damage. (270 with normal splash into Overkill, which is also nothing to sneeze at! That's 9 more points than her Close D, f+A, C Mayhem->Splash Followup...)
-----
One more note: Dokken (her overhead) Doesn't combo out of weak normals... but it does get the speed of a canceled normal, when used after weak attacks. Thus, you can do a quick 2 hit crouch b, crouch A, then immediately go into Dokken, as an odd form of reset into Mayhem / Gorefest. Of course people could jab out of this, or just block, but it's a nice thing to possibly catch them un-aware, and a psuedo-blockstring, as they don't even have enough time to jump between the crouch A into Dokken. If they DO try to jump, they get hit, and you get a free combo!
-
Can anyone post good Vice matches? I've been losing a lot with her and want to see how other usually win with her?
-
Can we get a list of Vice players and their footage? Im Curious to see the different playstyles for her
Most of these are from the arcade version. I meant to post these days ago for you but been busy with work.
Almost and OCV, you can check for the rest of the matches on tube.
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o60yM7-Q12Q#ws)
-
Couple more here,
Some others just gonna list.
Vice is in this, Pretty cool Vice mirror match at the end after 9:49.
http://youtu.be/7UpscJilX0M. (http://youtu.be/7UpscJilX0M)
Pretty decent Vice right here. Shes in the first two matches, does much better in the second match.
http://youtu.be/eBnRDANZGW4 (http://youtu.be/eBnRDANZGW4)
-
That all i have atm. If anybody knows anymore fill us in please. =D.
Been too busy to be searching for vids.
-
I know there has been a similar 100% console combos like this one posted before, but this is SNKP's version: バイス「マニアックコンボ」改 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdiIniSoWWI#ws)
-
KOF XIII Vice DOUBLE HD 100% (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03Y1tMN2Jhg#)
I have no words.
-
I saw this earlier, I'm not a Vice player but jesus christ that was foolish
-
lovely.
I cant seem to get my head around that C mayhem into st.a. Is it dependent on the distance from the corner?
-
BERZERK!! O.O
Love how the taunt was thrown in during the stun for style.
Again, wow.
-
Im sure he coulda whiffed 2 gorefests for meter and then taunted lolol
-
The c mayhem into St.a is just a tough link, you can do it any where. It is something I plan to steal for punish combos, because it's a pretty good way to add damage without drive.
-
U sure you can do it anywhere?
-
yes you can do it anywhere
-
Omg it's me or s.C leads to 403 Dmg with one Ex if you do this combo :
s.C,f.A,qcb.C,s.A,hcf.BD,s.C,f.A,qcb.C,qcf.C?
Hopefully the s.A is hard to do.
-
U sure you can do it anywhere?
I made this vid showcasing the max amount of sA, hcf+BD loops you can do. It also shows it being done out of corner.
vice.avi (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1zPvFHDHZI#ws)
-
Man that's scary, that link is haaard. I guess after playing some hardcore KOF players over the weekend I shouldn't be surprised though.
I accidentally found out a pointless but amusing combo Vice can do that I dunno if anyone knew about. You can cancel a sweep into Splash into Overkill and it will combo. Youl'd think the input for that would be hard, but you can just do a ;db ;dn ;df ;fd ;uf ;up ;ub ;bk ;db ;dn ;df motion and it will do a Splash that immediately super cancels into Overkill (double tapping the ;l doesn't hurt either). It can miss from a max range sweep, but you don't have to be right on top of them either. Might depend how tall the character is too, since they're sort of lying sideways in the air from the sweep.
-
Funny you mention that, I'm working with that and some other stuff right now.
Its great that it doesn't need to be CH for it to work. If you have good reaction with hit confirm, there is a fairly straight forward combo that you can do via bypass that nets you just under 770 damage.
-
what do you guys feel is her best use for meter, obviously she needs a lot of it, but where is it best to cconserve or use? do you generally want to use save it for a big hd combo with EX deicides? or is it worth it to blow some HD and meter for more damaging bnbs?
are there any combos that are worth the damage for more than 1+ bar and 1 drive?
-
I'm not an expert but I'll try to give my point of view.
I rarely use more than 1 or 2 stocks in combos, except when I use HD mode. I try to keep them for EX Deicide since it's free juggle and can lead to damaging combos and you can use this after j.CD or even after a simple anti air.
You can also use your stocks when you land a random non-EX Deicide and combo into her EX Negative Gain.
Hope this helps, also looking for those kind of informations.
-
U sure you can do it anywhere?
I made this vid showcasing the max amount of sA, hcf+BD loops you can do. It also shows it being done out of corner.
vice.avi (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1zPvFHDHZI#ws)
o_o I'm speechless. Trying to work out if this is cheap or awesome. I doubt I'd ever have the execution ability to pull it off though, so I guess it's kinda arbitrary. x_x Do people use it a lot in higher level play?
-
U sure you can do it anywhere?
I made this vid showcasing the max amount of sA, hcf+BD loops you can do. It also shows it being done out of corner.
vice.avi (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1zPvFHDHZI#ws)
o_o I'm speechless. Trying to work out if this is cheap or awesome. I doubt I'd ever have the execution ability to pull it off though, so I guess it's kinda arbitrary. x_x Do people use it a lot in higher level play?
not yet from what I've seen but, to me, it seems 100% match practical. I still have to test it out vs. different chars hitboxes but it is not bad at all. real nice damage for 1 bar no drive.
-
I tested it out against the whole cast and it works on everyone. (Well, not the full cast actually, I don't have Saiki or DLC chars but I suppose that they have the same hitboxes than Ash, Kyo, Takuma and Iori, but if someone can test on these so we are sure...)
Tests done midscreen and in the corner, using st. D, f. A, qcb + D, s. A, hcf + BD.
-
I doubt the DLC chars are different than their vanilla versions.. I don't have em either though.
one thing I was wondering about. Is Deicide's normal versions strictly for combos? are they safe on block? can you frame trap people with them? I'm trying to find more uses for them.. they seem kinda risky but not totally unusable as pokes, and I'm pretty sure canceling a B into B deicide makes for a good frame trap
-
B decide is a decent footsie tool because vice has a lot of tools to stop far hops. Between hop b, far d, and hop CD, a lot of feel safer sticking to the ground, and b decide can keep then honest. B decided is very safe on block so it is a decent frame trap option indeed.
-
Any tips on the qcb+C -> st.A link? I can't get it down. x_x
I've been trying: cl. D, f. A, qcb + C, s. A, hcf + BD
-
Any tips on the qcb+C -> st.A link? I can't get it down. x_x
I've been trying: cl. D, f. A, qcb + C, s. A, hcf + BD
Delay the qcb+C as much as possible, midscreen you dont need to delay it much but in the corner u have to pretty much cancel into the mayhem as late as possible or the s.A will whiff.
-
Any tips on the qcb+C -> st.A link? I can't get it down. x_x
I've been trying: cl. D, f. A, qcb + C, s. A, hcf + BD
Delay the qcb+C as much as possible, midscreen you dont need to delay it much but in the corner u have to pretty much cancel into the mayhem as late as possible or the s.A will whiff.
Thanks, I'll try that.
-
Any tips on the qcb+C -> st.A link? I can't get it down. x_x
I've been trying: cl. D, f. A, qcb + C, s. A, hcf + BD
Delay the qcb+C as much as possible, midscreen you dont need to delay it much but in the corner u have to pretty much cancel into the mayhem as late as possible or the s.A will whiff.
Thats not true...You dont need to delay it.
-
yeah, when you cancel into mayhem has no bearing on following up with s.A
the s.A link is tricky. some days I can hit it 85-90% of the time. others less than 10%. this is a sprite based game though, you just gotta watch carefully because imo the visual cues are much clearer than they are in SF4... midscreen, just wait til Vice stops moving. in the corner, watch for when she stands straight up after mayhem's recovery.
-
heh.. u dont NEED to delay it, but so far I've had much better success rate when I delay it, when i just do it becomes stupidly hard for whatever reason so /shrug.
Do you guys have any good ticks/mixups into Gorefest? im trying to use that more now that I can do the input at will but idk how to use it as a pressure/mixup tool. Thoughts?
Some Deicide tricks/mixups would be cool too. Vice is currently my weakest link and she's my anchor so any help is appreciated =/
-
Gorefest is the command grab right?
i have a cool way to buffer it doing, HCB, FF+Punch
it's a good way to do a quick dash and then land the command grab.
-
hcb f is enough to input a dash. Are you doing ff because yon don't do it fast enough?
-
Ohh that's genius! i didn't think that it would do that for me. i will definitely do it that way from now on.
mixing that up with st.B would be so gdlk!
-
While everywhere juggle with ex decide and using that raw to confirm any aa/a2a is nice, remember that you can do so much more from a counter air cd. Here are two combos that i want to start using when i land that counter air cd for 2 stock, one drive:
Mid screen: CH j.cd, dash forward, ;dn ;d xx ex decide, ;c > ;fd ;a, ;c tackle, super. Little less than 500 dmg iirc
For easy confirm simply dash after landing from the cd. Most of the time you'll have enough time to dash before an ex decide if you didn't CH anyway, plus it's not a bad idea to get closer before spending the meter. You'll want to try to hit with the top of the sweep. If you are close you can go for another j.cd instead of the sweep for more damage, but the sweep variation works at farther distances.
Corner: CH j.cd, ;a tackle [DC] ex tackle, j.cd, ex decide, ;c > ;fd ;a, ;c tackle. A little more than 500.
Easier, and more damage. Just make sure the first tackle hits them low to the ground and you're all set.
Also, who knows how to beat billy with her, because i'm convinced it's impossible.
-
Is it possible to land an Overkill after an EX Gore Fest?
-
Don't think so. Even if you get overkill to start when you are actually touching the opponent when they are coming down from gorefest(or EX), doesn't hit. Too bad though yeah? That would look awesome.
-
Vice frame data up:
http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=Vice_(XIII)#Move_Metadata (http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=Vice_(XIII)#Move_Metadata)
-
Nice ! °_°
But there are some remarks that I don't understand :
Splash 80 0 23,32,27,35 - Vs Iori: s.A, S.C, d.A, d.C
Variable start-up ? Does it means that it will have 23 start up frames if I cancel s.A into this ?
EX Gorefest(1) 25 0 1 - Whiff all frames 36
Is that some king of invicibility ?
Negative Gain(1) 70 0 30(1) - Freeze 29
It is supposed to have 1 start up frames. What the "30" means ?
Also, how is that possible to combo Mayhem C after D Decide but not cl.D after D Decide ? Is that a cancel of Decide's recovery frames by a special move without using drive ?
-
Also, how is that possible to combo Mayhem C after D Decide but not cl.D after D Decide ? Is that a cancel of Decide's recovery frames by a special move without using drive ?
The D Decide is free cancelable into the C Mayhem, kinda like Chin and Billy can free cancel (i.e. without using drive) some special moves into others.
The B and D Decides don't put Vice at a significant frame advantage which is why you sort of link the command throw or super after them (which combo because they have just 1 frame startup). EX Decide on the other hand does put her at a significant enough advantage to be able to combo with sC, sD etc.
Its a balancing act basically, if you could combo normally after a non ex Decide then she would have an infinite. She can do it now but only as long as she has meter.
-
I just figured out recently that Vice's neomax after her Overkill DM can have the input be done either way due to Vice being directly above the opponent during Overkill. This might have some use in matches as it allows you to choose which side you want to go to. Not sure if this is old news or not though.
-
I just want to say I've been having a lot of fun with Vice's blockstrings in this game. She has so many interesting things to challenge the opponent with.
Her trip can be cancelled into her command normal which can then be cancelled into Deicide for safety or Splash to be mean. Using Splash against a cornered opponent is so goddamn good if their reactions aren't up to snuff. Whether or not the A version connects seems to be character and depth specific, but the C version will definitely reach if they're in the corner at the expense of giving them more time to react. Still, if you're against a character where the A version works and they don't poke her out of it, it's a lot of fun and feels very dirty.
Far as I know Vice is the only character in the game that can end a blockstring with an unguardable hit. Good times.
-
Yeah, she's really fun.
So far I don't get why people insist on saving meter for her HD so often, meterless damage is not bad but anything tagged on at the end scales like crazy. You can get similar or better damage by supercanceling splash whenever the opportunity arises, you also continuously use and build meter this way. You are also building meter mid combo as well, so many times I had my meter finish building just when the Splash followup hits.
EX Splash is so fast, looks very brutal too. The invincibility on it doesn't seem very reliable though, pretty small window.
That string you mention is very solid, makes for a nice frame trap too. I prefer doing it after cr.B x3 instead of sweep though, lets you hit confirm into a combo or transition into the block string if they are blocked.
In terms of pokes I think far s.C is my fave right now.
-
anyone got any tips vs. projectile chars?(ie takuma)
seems like i can't get in a safe way.
-
I don't really like using sweep>f.a because after trying it out the f.a will whiff when you use the sweep at the range you'd normally use it. It can really leave you open. Sweep straight into decide is the way to go imo. I second using cr.b>f.a, as well.
If you want to talk pokes, use far d and learn how amazing that normal is. Hits high as hell, but still touches crouchers.
Vs. projectile chars you just have to learn how to get around each particular fireball and wait them out. If they want to sit back and chuck fire then they'll push them selves in the corner. If they want to push out, just stick your ground, because vice has the tools to be a wall of normals.
Oh, and jokes: sweep>HD>air grab>neomax.
-
anyone got any tips vs. projectile chars?(ie takuma)
seems like i can't get in a safe way.
The best thing to do is wait it out and see if they get impatient in my opinion. Blocking fireballs builds you a ton of meter for negligible chip damage, and you gain significantly more meter than the person throwing the projectile. And if you have meter, all it takes is an anti-air to lead to big damage. As for Takuma's close fireball, you can sweep under it with Vice and cancel into her EX Decide for an anywhere juggle combo. If they insist on staying back and get really predictable with their fireball game, you can do the C version of Splash if you read a fireball coming, and cancel into her Overkill DM.
-
Speaking of tough matchups, I feel like she has a tough time against the other grapplers, who all have much more dominant normals. At times I feel like I have to let them in and guess right because having to close the gap against a Clark or Daimon is brutal at times.
Not sure if it's known, but max damage for 1 meter in hd comes from doing ;d,;d>hd>;d,;d>;c tackle>ex tackle [wait] ;a tackle>;d decide into however many reps you get after that with ;c tackle>;d decide. The timing is a bit hard for that ;a tackle to get down at first, but you just want to wait as much as possible.
-
Would putting her on my team as the second character be advisable?
-
I like her second. For me I like putting her on a team where I can give her a lot of meter and have the anchor play with whatever meter is given. Vice gets damage off a lot of stuff, and doesn't necessarily need drive. The only downside to this is there are not a lot of teams that can fit this dynamic, and makes meter management a little trickier. Putting her on anchor frees up some of that team-building and decision making, but can get you in a bind if you find yourself using too much meter and having to stick in there with Vice alone.
Just don't put her first lol.
-
Been putting time into her and it seems this con from the wiki...
Does not build meter very well
...might be inaccurate. It seems Vice is unique in that her meter building ability resides in her combos.
Not sure who updates her wiki but imo her combos should be divided into damage focused (more damage, less meter build up) or meter focused (build more meter, sacrifice a little damage).
-
Been putting time into her and it seems this con from the wiki...
Does not build meter very well
.
Not sure who updates her wiki
No one is really focused on her wiki at the moment. You want to help?
-
Most already know since it's been on the front page in the past but Vice can combo EX Decide off of regular throw on Athena & Chin. Just figure to put this on the page since it's been awhile someone's posted on here.
-
Omg that's great... One of our top player uses Chin... and this gives huge advantage against him...
Ok sooo I officially picked up Vice... I played her a lot in 98/2k2... However, she lost my favorite move (her qcb+K kicks that chipped) so I didn't feel like playing her... Since I'm originally a grappler, recently I got bored with just pure rush down... As I can see, her pokes aren't on the same level as my other characters... (Billy/Mai) but she has some really awesome tools and tons of decision and options... Something Billy and specially Mai lacks... I am sure most of this is known but I guess I'll share her strenghs that I find amazing...
-
s.C+D, hcf+D is a true block string and is safe on block... It also combos on counter hit and she can do qcb+C/AC and follow-up with further combo...
From hop she has an instant active + DM > Neomax for 670 damage for 3 meters... This potentially a grab Neomax that does huge damage for being done raw... Also her Neomax hits full screen and from behind her and does 560 damage on counter hit... Since she can also turn virtually anything into an HD combo, if she ever has 3 meters and full HD then you literally should fear her existence on the screen...
Also I'm practicing linking s.A consistently after qcb+C as it greatly increases her damage output with spending just 1 meter... From a j.C she gets 448 damage mid-screen which is really high...
Also I got a 100% reset with her today from a cross-up j.B into HD into hcf+B and them blocking and eating DM > Neomax... I believe her tick > HD > grab DM > Neomax is rather strong and should be utilized more...
-
You can also reset if you just wait a little after any hcf.b/d during the hd combo before going into DM.
-
Random: You can set up a crossup j.B off of EX cmd grab. And it can be done deep enough to get ;d ~ ;d for an HD combo or whatever. Gimmicky but cool. Who expects a vice crossup?
EDIT: oh cool.
-
Doesn't need to be EX grab. You can do it from the regular command grab as well.
-
This was front paged AWHILE back but it's good to keep it in this group
KoF XIII : Vice combo compilation (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJNwHI9HLAE#ws)
-
Good stuff. I'll need to look over this to see if I can't improve the combos on the wiki. Found a vid on Orochinagi that opens up more possibilities to explore as well. Apparently you can connect an Overkill after a sweep. Who knew!
Also something that I recently came across, though it was not mentioned in either the dream cancel or srk wiki, Vice's cr. C is actually whiff cancellable. was trying to come up with a good reason to make use of this, but didn't come up with much. perhaps as a slightly faster kara cancel for deicide, or a wall of anti-air with mayhem? Not in a position to test it for awhile though...
One more thing: I've seen people doing something along the lines of qcb+C, [DC] qcb+AC, qcb+A, cl. D, hcf+BD, etc. But I've yet to be able to pull it off in my own testing. Anyone know the conditions for that?
-
Good stuff. I'll need to look over this to see if I can't improve the combos on the wiki. Found a vid on Orochinagi that opens up more possibilities to explore as well. Apparently you can connect an Overkill after a sweep. Who knew!
Also something that I recently came across, though it was not mentioned in either the dream cancel or srk wiki, Vice's cr. C is actually whiff cancellable. was trying to come up with a good reason to make use of this, but didn't come up with much. perhaps as a slightly faster kara cancel for deicide, or a wall of anti-air with mayhem? Not in a position to test it for awhile though...
One more thing: I've seen people doing something along the lines of qcb+C, [DC] qcb+AC, qcb+A, cl. D, hcf+BD, etc. But I've yet to be able to pull it off in my own testing. Anyone know the conditions for that?
That's a rep of the Vice infinite from the game's beginnings, look at this for a better idea of what it's supposed to look like
ãƒã‚¤ã‚¹ã€Œãƒžãƒ‹ã‚¢ãƒƒã‚¯ã‚³ãƒ³ãƒœã€æ”¹ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdiIniSoWWI#ws)
-
I don't think it's been mentioned before, but I found out you can actually go under some projectiles with C version Mayhem. Reason being, she does a short duck before she charges forward, so if you can start the move right before the projectile connects the duck will lower her hitbox enough to let them through. Did a non-comprehensive test on some characters main projectiles; These are the ones you can certainly go under:
King's Venom Strike
Ash's Ventose
Saiki's Kiyoko no Tsuki
Ryo's Kohken
Robert's Ryugekiken
Leona's Earring Bakuden (on the upward arc for obvious reasons)
Yuri's Ko Ou Ken (will probably trade with the latter half of the active frames though)
Maxima's Vapor Press
So yeah. something useful that I'd found. I'm wanting to try to apply it as a midscreen punish about at the same range you'd want to try an EX Mayhem for a projectile punish
-
Wow, I didn't know that. I'm sure a Vice player I know will like that.
-
That's really cool, considering how difficult a time she has against fireballs. I assume C mayhem builds meter? It could be an interesting (but risky) way to build meter full screen too.
-
Yeah it does. And I'm glad I could help! ^.^ I was pretty excited when I noticed it myself; really hoping I can connect it on Ash a few times especially.
-
So, actually, can she do that to Mr. Karate? I dunno, I'm digging and praying, but would be nice. Also, can she do that under moving projectiles like maybe Terry's Burn Knuckle?
-
So, actually, can she do that to Mr. Karate?
Karate's invisipalm? If that's what you were thinking, I don't think that's a projectile, so it probably doesn't have the same properties.
-
It's not projectile invuln, it just low profiles some moves. And I thought it counted as a projectile? idk.
I can try it later, but he's probably too short to go under it :< I couldn't go under Takuma projectile for the same reason.
-
KOF XIII - Vice bnb comparison & safe jump setup (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nG3mxqTKok0#ws)
-
Would someone mind detailing the Gorefest xx crossup j.B setup mentioned earlier on this page? I wanna try that out as soon as I can! I'll add ;c Mayhem vs. projectiles to my labwork list as well. Also this little story here ;dn
After seeing the post mentioning sweep xx overkill (literally just now before I started writing this) I hit the lab and tested it myself since I assume the only way that works is to HD cancel the sweep and perform a jump instantly after. Finding that to be relatively easy, I started testing bnbs with overkill in order to practice the input, since ;bk ;db ;dn ;df ;fd ;uf ;up ;bk (as well as the 360 shortcut) is quite the pain in the ass to perform on D-pad. As usual, I found inputting Overkill from the P2 side to be pretty much impossible.
Somehow inspiration struck me, and after recalling a certain casual SF4 session wherein I picked Gief just to see how easy it was to perform 360 motions on a dualshock's analog stick (A Gief player I know once told me some of the best Gief mains use pad with him for exactly that reason) I put two and two together and started using the control stick to shortcut the super, since I had absolutely no consistent results in attempting to do this before. Keep in mind that I was just doing the move raw, as I've never been able to use it in my combos...
The real stroke of genius however, came when I attempted to perform Mayhem xx ITE JANAI YO xx Overkill via inputting the tackle and dunk normally, but switching my thumb over to the control stick in order to input the super. What I was intensely surprised to discover was that this WORKED. And it was EASY. ON EITHER SIDE. So yeah, now I have a consistent way to cancel into overkill. But wait, what if I could also mash the max cancel on the control stick without any trouble? YUP, THAT WORKS TOO! (Also on either side!) What does that mean? Hello optimized HD combos!
I can't help but find it strange that I've only now discovered this solution after spending quite a lot of time attempting to make use of overkill in my Vice combos before to absolutely no avail... It's like I just found a lifehack that actually works, and all it does is cover this exact execution hurdle. It would be upsetting if I weren't incredibly pleased with how awesome it is that I can do this now. I mean, before today I wouldn't mind using PS1 pads with no analog sticks, since for me those two little pieces of plastic were essentially a fashion statement with no practical use... only now I do have a reason for them to be there, and it's a legitimate one! O_O
-
@3:58
KoF XIII : Duelling the KOF 12th Season. Day 1, B Block [Part 7] (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_KvU_MjvpI#ws)
Vice cancels her tackle into a Splash, but the cancel counted as a Drive Cancel. How did that happen? Usually, Vice can do that without having to Drive Cancel.
-
The player inputted dp+A/C instead of qcf+A/C after qcb+A/C
-
Oh, I see. I've never heard of a player accidentally do that.
But now that I know that kind of cancel exists, is there even any use for that? Or is that just a superfluous cancel?
-
It's pretty much superfluous, but super cancelling the non-followup Splash into Overkill works, so if for some reason you want to style on the opponent in HD mode (or make a CMV) that's a possible route.
-
Not sure if common knowledge (it's not listed in the wiki) but Vice can combo ex sleeve (hcf+BD) from a normal throw against Athena and Chin.
-
Not sure if common knowledge (it's not listed in the wiki) but Vice can combo ex sleeve (hcf+BD) from a normal throw against Athena and Chin.
Someone posted a video of that somewhere here but I can't find it anymore. I remember some people going nuts over it.
-
www.youtube.com/watch?v=DrO6HR2vqZE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DrO6HR2vqZE#ws)
I did ages ago
-
By the logic on why this happens,this should work on Yuri and Kensou too!! But it doesn't.....