Dream Cancel Forum
King of Fighters XIII => Character Discussion => K' => Topic started by: nilcam on December 14, 2011, 12:38:05 AM
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http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=K%27_(XIII) (http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=K%27_(XIII))
Submissions, questions, comments and feedback should be posted here.
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I feel we should really test out the properties of his moves in detail. At face value a lot of this stuff is very interesting, like Ein Trigger => Second Shoot having some sort of invincibility on start-up.
Also, we no longer have to depend on ....=>[HDA] st.C (1), qcf+A as a combo starter in midscreen. For example, you can do st.C, f+A [HDA], st.C, f+A ~delay~ qcb+Dx2 (quickly). You can actually buffer it pretty well and it connects midscreen even off a jump-in. I think this should be the standard as it does more damage with no meter.
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Added in some changes to the wiki for K' which included editing some of his specials with the changes that are apparent for the moves. I also added in whether the moves cause hard knockdown or not. I didn't do that for normals though.
In the Narrow spike section, I added the uses of doing st.C, f+A into (qcb+D)x2. Let me know if I'm missing something.
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http://keykakko.wordpress.com/2012/01/13/a-beast-of-prey/ (http://keykakko.wordpress.com/2012/01/13/a-beast-of-prey/)
Note: When reading frame data, remember this: Start up frames are the frames it takes BEFORE the move becomes active. So it'll be active on the very next frame.
Normals
| Name | Dmg | Hitstun | Startup | Recovery frames |
| st.A | 25 | 3F | 4F | +2 |
| Far A | 25 | 3F | 4F | +1 |
| d.A | 25 | 3F | 4F | +2 |
| j.A | 45 | 3F | 8F | N/A |
| hop A | 40 | 3 | 8F | N/A |
| st.B | 30 | 3F | 5F | +1 |
| Far B | 30 | 3F | 4F | +1 |
| d.B | 30 | 3F | 5F | +1 |
| j.B | 45 | 3F | 4F | N/A |
| hop B | 40 | 3F | 4F | N/A |
| st.C (1) | 40 | 6F | 5F | N/A |
| st.C (2) | 30 | 4F | N/A | -8 |
| Far C | 70 | 7F | 6F | -11 |
| d.C | 70 | 7F | 10F | -9 |
| j.C | 72 | 7F | 9F | N/A |
| hop C | 70 | 7F | 8F | N/A |
| st.D | 70 | 7F | 7F | -6 |
| Far D | 80 | 7F | 8F | -10 |
| d.D | 80 | 7F | 9F | -8 |
| j.D | 70 | 7F | 10F | N/A |
| hop D | 68 | 7 | 9F | N/A |
| CD | 75 | 10 | 14 | -6 |
| j.CD | 90 | 8F | 10F | N/A |
| hop CD | 80 | 8F | 10F | N/A |
Command Normals
| Name | Dmg | Hitstun | Startup | Recovery frames |
| One-Inch (Combo'd) | 60 | 4F | 15F | -6 |
| One-Inch (1) | 75 | 12F | 22F | -2 |
| GCCD | 4 | 0F | 13F | -15 |
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Is the recovery frames on hit or on block the same?
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Pretty sure it's on block.
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Update: K' frame data is now on the wiki.
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1-2 stock HDs
1 bar HD 731 damage
jC > cl C XX fA > BC > cl C XX fA XX 214D(whiff) > 214D(slide followup) > (623A [DC] 214D > 214D(whiff))*4 > 623A [DC] 236C > fD > fA > 2363214P
1 bar HD 747 damage
jC > cl C XX fA > BC > cl C XX fA XX 214D(whiff) > 214D(slide followup) > (623A [DC] 236C > fD > fA)*4 > 2363214P
2 bar HD 803 damage
jC > cl C XX fA > BC > cl C XX fA XX 214D(whiff) > 214D(slide followup) > (623A [DC] 214D > 214D(whiff))*4 > 623A XX 6321463214AC
there are obviously many ways to confirm into HD with K', i might write some crap up in the near future
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Added, but I changed the format to match the rest of the combo format. Number notation helps a lot, but I want to be consistent with the rest of the wiki.
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If needed, you can put number formats as a side note if its really specific.
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So it took me a while to figure out how to do the Air Minute Spike follow up to the Heat Drive and EX Chain Drive. I think it would be handy to add that it's easiest to do ;dn ;db ;bk ;bk ;b (as in off the backdash) to the wiki rather than just "allows you to do an Air Minute Spikes to continue" seeing as it's pretty tricky at first glance.
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So it took me a while to figure out how to do the Air Minute Spike follow up to the Heat Drive and EX Chain Drive. I think it would be handy to add that it's easiest to do ;dn ;db ;bk ;bk ;b (as in off the backdash) to the wiki rather than just "allows you to do an Air Minute Spikes to continue" seeing as it's pretty tricky at first glance.
Added it to EX Chain Drive's description.
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I feel like we don't need to post up combos because that's already doing its job in the console thread. If anything it's important to have match up knowledges on what you can/can not punish etc. Alot of players may play these characters themselves as well but some of them don't have the knowledge about it or it's not even on the wiki for some reason (I understand some of you mods/admins are busy, so sorry if I sound like I'm putting you on blast) It's best that if we focus on that instead of posting up sick combos etc. I don't mind people posting up how to do DP into Ein Trigger or how to do instant Narrow Spike etc those are fine. There are some things that are wrong on these notes and I did my best to make it accurate as possible so if I made a mistake, I'm sorry!
(?) = I'm not too sure about it
Well this is for Joe vs K Match up,I'll contribute right here (there's alot of things I haven't tested yet but I would like some help to make sure)
Joe Higashi
•You can hop over his Hurricane Upper even tho it looks like you can't
•If he starts going for Standing C into Forward+B into Golden Heel (QCB+K) you can just interrupt it in between Forward+B and Golden Heel on all 3 Versions by DP
•His EX Hurricane Upper will BEAT your EX Fireball
-Guard Cancel Roll the first Hurricane Upper to avoid the rest of them
-K Dash: EX or Regular Chain Drive will beat it clean
-KYO: EX or Regular Orochinagi beat it
-KULA: Her regular counter will beat it clean
-KULA: Her EX Diamond Dust or Freezing Execution will beat it
•Standing A or Standing C into Forward+B then in C Version of Hurricane Upper is punishable ONLY by Guard Cancel Roll as the Forward+B touch you
•Standing A or Standing C into Forward+B then in A Version of Hurricane Upper is NOT a true blockstring you can just roll in between Forward+B and Hurricane Upper
-KULA: You can use the counter after the Forward+B before Joe's Fire Ball hits you
-KULA: You can EX DP between Forward+B & Fire Ball
•If Joe throws out a Thrust Kick across the screen, Do NOT punish it since he will do a D Version of the Tiger Kick (DP+K) after the Thrust Kick, just block it
-All 3 Versions of the Thrust Kick are punishable
-EX Thrust Kick will go right past by you if you're ducking low so just block standing up.
•All 3 Versions of Tiger Kick (DP+K) are punishable on block
Leona Heidern
•You want to fight her Mid/Close Range so she doesn't use V-Slasher as much as she like to
-If you're gonna zone her out, zone her correctly or else you'll going to eat V-Slasher on a counter hit if you're throw out a fire ball.
•Her Standing CD puts her on plus when you block it (?)
•She has to burn a meter for a Full/Mid Screen HD Combo so keep this in mind as she has full HD with or without meter
-You can take advantage of this when she doesn't have 1 meter to pressure her
-If she does have one meter, pressure her to make her use it for EX Moves or Guard Cancel Blowback or Guard Cancel Roll.
•Her Close Standing D have lower body invisibility.
-This is similar to Kim's Far Standing D so you have to poke her with Crouching A
•Raw Overhead (Forward+B) can be interrupt on reaction by DP/Standing C/Super
-If you get hit by this, it's a hard knockdown
•Standing C moves her forward so you can Down+B to stop her from moving in
•Standing C into Forward+B into A Version of X-Calibur is punishable if you run fast enough after blocking the X-Calibur
-C Version of X-Calibur will MISS Mid Screen ONLY and FREE punish if you're fast on reaction but if not then she'll do a normal throw.
-C Version of X-Calibur is safe on block if you're crouching
-C Version of X-Calibur is NOT safe on block if you're standing and Punish with Down+B
-EX X-Calibur can be avoid if you block then Guard Cancel Roll forward to punish her
•All 3 Versions of her Moon Slash (Charge Down to Up+P) is punishable
•Her EX & D Version of her Grand Saber (Charge Back to Forward+K) is safe on block but you can just DP/Super to interrupt it
-Her B Version is not safe tho
-Only EX Version can go through Fire Balls
•All 3 Versions of her Baltic Launcher (Charge Back to Forward+P) is safe on block
-KULA: Freezing Execution or EX Diamond Dust will beat it but Counter will NOT beat it
-KULA: Her Slide (Requires Spacing) can beat it by going under it.
-KYO: EX Orochinagi will beat it clean
-K Dash: Regular or EX Chain Chain will beat it
-DP/EX DP will get her but it's spacing dependent. If you're close you'll get her, if you're just barely out of the ball hitbox, don't try it.
-Don't waste a meter for a Guard Cancel Roll to punish
-If you're blocking this low, a good chance that she'll go for an overhead so just block high right away
-If you have a quick move like EX Orochinagi you can super before the overhead hits you
-DO NOT GUARD CANCEL BLOWBACK THIS! You will miss her because of the pushback of the Orb and she can just do Far Standing C into HD Combo for 60% to DEATH!
•If she does the Baltic Launcher (Any Versions) as you're block, just block low so she'll go for an overhead, in between time of the Orb & Overhead, there's enough time to interrupt her overhead on counter hit or you can just block up
-If you have a quick invisibility moves like EX Orochinagi, use it
•Her Earring Bombs can be DP through or duck under it.
-Both Earring Bombs have the different startup speed but EX Earring Bomb recovers & startup faster.
-B Version of the Earring Bomb goes 50% of the screen then it bounces
-D Version of the Earring Bomb goes almost full screen
-EX Version of the Earring Bomb goes 50% of the screen then it bounces
•If she's just throwing Earring Bombs, do NOT jump! She wants you to jump to eat a Moon Slash/Super
-Instead just walk forward and block. If you have a move that reaches far you can just interrupt her to stop her.
-Spend a meter if you have to.
-Sometimes she'll go for Grand Saber, with good timing you can DP through both the bomb & the attack (This is Characters & Spacing Dependent)
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Thanks for your contribution. I will probably mess around in training mode and test some of that myself and let you know if it works or not. If things are good and if Reiki approves, then he will add it to the character match up section.
If you have anymore findings, please share them.
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I have about notes about this for my characters only tho (Which it's just K/Kula/Kyo) Please ask Kane317 about it for other characters like Chin/Shen/Clark etc
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I can verify everything posted by DJ, barring the Thrust kick mention, as D version is prohibitively unsafe.
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Duo Lon
•His Genmu Kyaku (Forward+B) homes in on you so you have to keep moving so just run forward to avoid it
•His Air Genmu Kyaku (Jumping Forward+B) can be beaten by DP or you can trade it with Down+C
-Air Genmu Kyaku is also an overhead as well
•If you get knockdown and Duo Lon running and does his Standing CD on your wakeup, just block the opposite way or roll back
-He can delay the timing where it doesn't cross up as well
-K DASH: Do EX Teleport to counter this because even if you input it wrong you'll get EX Minute Spike which has Guard Point on start up frames.
-If he does it while you're in the corner, he'll ALWAYS be in front of you
•A Version of the Juon Shikon (QCB+A) is safe on block but EX & C Versions are not
-If they're doing a blockstring ending with EX Juon Shikon, just Guard Cancel Roll through it
-If you hit him as the Juon Shikon is out, it'll disappear
-If you're attempt to jump over the fireball, you'll eat a Standing C or Down+C
•All 3 Versions & all 3 HITS of his Suteki Juryu (QCF+P) are punishable on block but they all lead to Hike Kyaku Zen (Teleport Forward) ONLY!
-If you're in the corner as he's doing his Suteki Juryu and then teleport, he'll ALWAYS be in front of you
-If he does B version of Hike Kyaku Zen after the THIRD hit of the Suteki Juryu, you can use Guard Cancel Roll Back and you'll end right in front of him to pressure/punish him
-KULA: EX Ray Spin just right after he teleport but Freezing Execution will NOT get him
-KYO: EX Orochinagi, NEO MAX or EX RDP Kick
-K Dash: He can risk a EX Minute Spike unless he spaced the EX Narrow Spike so he can't be punished.
-If it's a D version of the Hike Kyaku Zen after the Suteki Juryu, Guard Cancel Roll will not help!
-KULA: EX DP or Freezing Execution (The timing for Super is really hard)
-KYO: EX Orochinagi or EX DP (But you only get the tip of the DP)
-K Dash: Heat Drive ONLY if he wants a hit in (Timing is hard)
•His B & EX Version of Hike Kyaku Zen goes the SAME Distance while D Version of Hike Kyaku Zen goes 70% of the screen
-This also applies the same to Hike Kyaku Ushiro (QCB+K) (Teleport Back)
Vice
•Her Jumping CD has practically no lower hit box!
•Do not CHALLENGE with her jumping CD Air to Air!
-If you can, just Down+B on her Jumping CD
•Her Jumping CD & Jumping C looks similar.
•Without meter, she doesn't have much to get in on you if you're going to zone her.
-The only options she has is Sleeve or Splash
-With meter she only has EX Tackle or EX Splash
•REMEMBER NOT TO JUMP ALOT WHEN SHE HAS METERS!!!
•If she jumps at you without any attacks just jump up since it's a command grab or Down+B
•Do NOT let her pressure you since you don't gain your meters as you're blocking against her sleeves!
-Keep that in mind, that Vice is the one that has to take the risk, NOT you!
•Her Command Grabs are 1 frame so just end your blockstrings carefully so you don't get grab in between
-EX Command Grab has a bigger range
•All 3 Versions of her Tackles are punishable on block
•All 3 Versions of her Sleeves are safe on block
-All 3 Version of her sleeves are punishable if you roll forward early
-If you see Vice does Standing CD then cancel into Sleeves, it goes a lot further!
•Her Forward+A is a overhead, just block high
-Standing B into Forward+A doesn't combo!
• All 3 Versions of her Splash are unblockable & catches rolls
-A Version of Splash goes 2 Characters Length
-C Version of Splash goes 70% of the screen
-EX Version of Splash homes in on you
-You can DP or neutral jump on Splash
•If she does Standing B into Splash, it's NOT a true blockstring so just hold back & up or if possible Standing A
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I haven't double check them because of internship and job searching but I forgot to mention that some certain specials can't be punished if it's spaced correctly but yeah if there's any mistakes let me know. Thank you
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Terry Bogard
•Jumping D can crossup easily so be careful blocking it
•Terry's Jumping CD has practically no lower hit box on it so you can just Anti Air freely
•All 3 Versions of Rising Tackle are not safe on block and it's free to punish
•Standing C into Down Forward+C into Crack Shoot can only be beaten by normal grab after Crack Shoot
-You can only use Guard Cancel Roll to get away but NOT punish!
-Certain characters Down+B will make the Crack Shoot whiff on you (?)
-If the Crack Shoot is spaced well, you can't punish it
-If your back is facing toward the Corner, you can Guard Cancel Roll on the Down Forward+C to avoid the Crack Shoot and to punish freely
•Down+B to Down+A to Down+C into any specials can be punished if you Guard Cancel Roll on the Down+A
-Most likely Terry will do Rising Tackle or Standing C into Combo after the Crack Shoot
•Crack Shoot is safe on block but if you know it's gonna come out, do a DP
•If he does a Standing CD somewhat out of your range it's a Crack Shoot or a Burn Knuckle so just DP to beat the Crack Shoot or Burn Knuckle
•All 3 Versions of Burn Knuckle are not safe so you can just punish it normally
-If he does an A Version of Burn Knuckle at a safe distance you can't punish it but you can interrupt it
Maxima
(?) = I'm not too sure
•Double Vapor Cannon (QCF X2 +P) has Guard Point all over his body in a blue shell
-The regular one you can avoid it is Guard Cancel Roll Forward or just time your roll forward for a free punish
•EX Double Vapor Cannon doesn't have Guard Point but it's 3 frames and does 2 hits
-You can block the first hit and just run forward & roll before the second hits comes out for a free punish
-If you can still get hit by him even if you're behind him but you can use super or EX moves
•When he does Standing C then Standing A then he can go for a D Version of Maxima Press so just jump up or just DP it or he can just Vapor Cannon
-This is NOT a true Block String
•Standing C, Standing D, Standing CD & Down+C have Guard Points so you have to hit him low (Except Down+C, which you'll have to hop in with an attack)
•He has a 1 Frame Command Grab so DO NOT END YOUR BLOCKSTRINGS WITH SPECIALS!!! END IT SAFE AS YOU CAN!
•His M4 Vapor Cannons are free to punish when you roll toward him in early
•All 3 Versions of M4 Vapor Cannons are safe on block but you can just Down+B it to beat it!
•His EX Air Vapor Cannons have Guard Point so just roll forward or block because he'll do a frametrap of Standing C into Vapor Cannon or just Vapor Cannon, the moment he lands to stop but keep in mind he can also do an command grab after the EX Air Vapor Cannon or Standing C
-DO NOT CHALLENGE THIS MOVE! HE WILL BEAT WHATEVER YOU DO CLEAN AND IT WILL BE A COUNTER HIT FOR HIM!
-You can just Guard Cancel Roll out of it and punish him as he lands
-K DASH: just EX Teleport out of there
•Both Versions of his M19 Blitz Cannon (DP+K) will NOT hit you if you're standing or crouching!
-His EX M19 Blitz Cannon is fast & will HIT you so just block!
•His D Version of Maxima Press (Command Grab) can grab you out of rolling but you can interrupt it by DP/Super/ SHORT HOP UP to punish him
-If you're in the corner then just Neutral Jump
- His B Version of Maxima Press (Command Grab) is a 1 Frame Command Grab
-His EX Maxima Press (Command Grab) is a HIT! NOT A GRAB SO JUST BLOCK IT!!
Clark Still
•His Air Throw is a hard knockdown
•His EX & D Version of the Command Grab is 1 frame so just end your blockstrings carefully so you don't get grab in between
-Remember that the both Version of the Command Grabs can't be cancel into Super.
-ONLY EX Command Grab can be cancel into Super
•Against his B Version of the Command Grab, just jump straight up or:
-KYO: Standing C then do QCF+D to beat it
-KULA: Down+B or Standing C then QCB+B to beat it
-K DASH: Down+B or Standing C then do QCB+B to beat it
•If he does a Command Dash, it's a poke or a Command Grab just backdash or jump back to take the hit. Better taking 1 hit than a command grab that leads to a mix up of 50/50
-He can cancel his Standing CD with Command Dash so be aware of it
•If he does Gatling Attack (Charge Back to Forward+P) then punish with Down+B ASAP
-Sometimes they will throw out a Command Grab after you block the Gatling Attack, so be careful
-EX Version of Gatling Attack goes through Fire Balls
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Once I finish doing all the cast I'll start adding the standing B into hd mode for max punish on certain specials/blockstrings Also I'm updating some of these right now because some of these notes are outdated and I have new info I have to correct/change
(?) = Not too sure
Ralf Jones
•Jumping D is an instant overhead
•Don't be always trying to poke him out of every string since he can just stuff it. Be patient!
•Standing CD pushes him forward alot so just Down+B
-Sometimes he'll cancel into Burning Hammer so be prepare to Guard Cancel Roll on Reaction
•EX Burning Hammer has Full Body Guard Point and not safe on block (?)
•Standing C into C Version of Burning Hammer (QCF+P) is safe but Ralf is most likely to press D after it so just poke him to interrupt him
-KULA: Standing B or Slide
-KYO: Standing D or Down Forward+D
-K DASH: Standing A, Standing B or Ein Trigger
•Jumping A into Blitzkrieg Punch (QCF+P in the Air) is NOT a real combo
-If you get hit by the jumping A, you can still block the Blitzkrieg Punch high in time
•A & C Versions of Blitzkrieg Punch can be punished by DPing it
-ALL 3 Versions of it are OVERHEAD! SO JUST BLOCK HIGH!
-His EX Version of Blitzkrieg Punch beat your DP so do NOT try it!
-You can roll in early if you see it coming for a punish
-You can use Guard Cancel Roll forward on block
•All 3 Version of Gatling Attacks are punishable
-Only A Version of Gatling Attack is punished with Down+Bs
•Explosive Punch (QCB+P) can be used as Anti Air but not alot of Ralf Players use it unless it's EX Explosive Punch
-The hitbox is smaller than what the animation looks like
Iori Yagami (Claw Version)
•Standing B is a free cancel into Yaotome (Both Regular and EX)
-Because of this, you must very careful with the Standing B range
•His wakeup speed is the fastest in the game
•His Down+D is punishable on block
•All his Supers are punishable on block
-His EX Yaotome will go through Fire Balls and have start up Invisibility Frames
•Yaotome (Maiden Masher) leads to a hard knockdown
-EX Yaotome also lead to a hard knockdown
•All 3 Versions of his Command Grabs can be avoid by Alternative Guard or Neutral Hop
•All 3 Versions of his DP can be punished on block
•Standing C to Forward+A to C Version of Shogetsu (QCB+P) is punishable in between by doing DP/Super (Spacing Dependent) The only way to tell if it's possible if there's delay between the hits.
-KULA: DP or EX DP
-KYO: DP or EX RDP Kick (Only works if your back is near the corner)
-K: DP or EX DP (Only works if your back is near the corner)
-A Version of Shogetsu (QCB+P) is NOT safe on block
-KULA: Standing B into DP will get it
-KYO:Standing B into QCF+B will get it
-K: Down+B into Fireball will get it
•All 3 Version of Akegarasu (QCB+K) are safe on block but it can be interrupted by DP/Super
-B Version of Akegarasu goes 1/3 of the screen.
-C Version of Akegarasu goes 3/4 of the screen.
-EX Akegarasu will go through Fire Balls
-EX Akegarasu have lower body invisibility
Takuma Sakazaki
•He doesn't have any form of reversal so take advantage of this
-Unless he has meters, his only choices are EX Command Grab, EX Zanretsuken, Ryukko Ranbu (QCF HCB+P), EX Kyoukugen Ko Oh (QCF+BD) or his Neo Max
•If he ends his block strings in odd manners (Like not ending it with Ko Ou Ken (Fire Ball) or Hienshippukyaku (Flying Kick) etc) then he's going for a Command Grab! Jump up, backdash or keep him out!
•This matchup is similar as you're fighting Vice but he can zone and doesn't need alot of meters to kill you and he can be a little risky.
•Takuma's jumping CD is hard to deal with because of how long it sticks out and how quick it sticks out so just Anti Air carefully
-KULA: Jumping B will win if you do it early
-KYO: Jumping B or D will do if you do it early
-K Dash: Jumping B
•When Takuma have meters be careful when you jump! Since he has an EX Zanretsuken (Forward to Back to Forward+AC) Which has anywhere juggle!
•EX Kyoukugen (QCF+AC) HOMES in on you!
-Super Jump, Roll or Hyper Hop can avoid it! But recommending Roll is a safer bet
•Standing C to Forward+B to C Version of Kyoukugen (QCF+C) can be interrupt in between by rolling forward
-KULA: She can counter or EX DP through the fireball after Forward+B
-KYO: C Version of DP will hit him but only by the tip or EX RDP Kick will get him
-K DASH: He can DP or EX Minute Spike to get him
•All 3 Versions of Takuma's Hienshippukyaku (Flying Kick) can be beaten by DP/Super on reaction
-Only EX and B Version are safe on block but can be interrupted
•Standing C to Forward+B to C Version of Kyoukugen Ko Ou (QCF+C) can be interrupted
-KULA: She can DP through the Kyoukugen Ko Ou but NOT counter
-KYO: He can just DP through it
-K DASH: He can just DP or EX Minute Spike through it
-His EX Kyoukugen Ko Ou (QCF+BD) is NOT safe and too slow on startup but it does have Guard Point on start up, most Takuma players will not use this much unless it's out of last resort
Robert Garcia
•If Robert have full drive meter & 2 meter, keep in mind that he can HD Bypass in the air for an Neo Max
-EX DP will beat this Neo Max clean if you have fast reaction
•Robert's A Version of his DP have NO invincibility on start up so you can just stuff it easily!
•Geneikyaku (Forward to Back to Forward+K) sticks out for awhile and sucks you in
-Just EX DP or Super
-It does catch you rolling (?)
•If you're blocking Robert's Jumping D at Max Range then he does EX Hienryujinkyaku (QCB+K in the Air) just Guard Cancel Roll or DP
-If you jumping in the air after the EX Hienryujinkyaku, it's a free juggle for Robert
-If you're still in the ground then it's a Command Grab
•Standing C to Forward+B to Fire Ball can be punished by Guard Cancel Roll on the Forward+B
-If you do block it and he jumps forward high then it's most likely a cross up so just block the other way, anti air it or roll out of there
•His Short Hop Crossup can be Down+C on reaction
•If Robert is in the corner and he flips back then it's most likely a wall jump so just neutral jump B to put him back in the corner
•EX Hienryujinkyaku (QCB+K in the Air) is safe on block but the both Versions of the Dive Kick are NOT but it's ONLY safe depending on Spacing!!!
-All of them can be beaten by DP
-D Version of Hienryujinkyaku is safe if it hits late/deep
•B Version of Hienshippukyaku (Charge Down Back to Forward+K) (Flying Kick) is safe on blocked but you can DP it to beat it or Guard Cancel Roll Forward to punish it
-D Version of it can be punished on blocked
-EX Hienshippukyaku is punishable by Down+B ONLY
-Also he can just DP you if he thinks you're gonna poke him
-If you're blocking low on EX Hienshippukyaku then it'll go right through you so just block standing
•All 3 Versions of his Command Grabs are NOT 1 Frame so you can just interrupt him or get away from it easier
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So far so good. I approve of all the match-up notes, but in terms of putting them up, I'm not sure how we're going to do it. It's not in paragraphs, but more cliffnotes.
Desmond, if you have some ideas to put up some of this crucial information, that'd be great. Atleast without it looking messy.
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Yeah the next set I'm going to do is the DLC/Console characters since people are having an hard time on how to punish/avoid them (Including myself)
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Yeah those are useful notes but I wouldn't really know where to put it either. Maybe in the match up section mainly because it's not such sporadic notes.
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Ok, after reading these notes through, these arent for K' against characters, mainly characters against others? Because if so, some of the notes are just general property descriptions of their specials, normals and command moves. Not sure would those go, probably added to his move descriptions if they aren't added. But the counters or ways to deal against other characters moves like this for example:
•Standing C to Forward+B to C Version of Kyoukugen Ko Ou (QCF+C) can be interrupted
-KULA: She can DP through the Kyoukugen Ko Ou but NOT counter
-KYO: He can just DP through it
-K DASH: He can just DP or EX Minute Spike through it
Would probably be added to every characters corresponding section in the match-up area like this: http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=King_%28XIII%29#Character_Matchups (http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=King_%28XIII%29#Character_Matchups)
Anyone agree or disagree?
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Yeah sorry for the confusion because I took these notes on my phone mostly
It's just for my characters only which it's Kula, Kyo and K Dash
its just a way to remind myself how to punish certain specials or mix ups with my characters and stuff.
I should reorganize the notes on my phone somehow since I'm just using the Note App on my iPhone 4
Also If I see something interesting at a session, videos or tournaments, I just type it on my phone and test it out at home.
I been lazy on my notes recently and I haven't been taking notes as well. I should start taking notes again soon.
To be honest, I don't know how I can even organize it if it's going to be on the wiki myself =/
Also Yuhang I need help on doing notes for Chin since I don't know how to excute the Stance Cancel because it seem like there's like hundreds of Stance Canceling on his normals and thousands of mix ups which it's driving my hands and my mind like crazy
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I just added some infomation to Leona/Maxima
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It's been a while, but I added a few things that might be useful for people.
I added 2 higher resources HD combos and a situational HD combo section.
The Situational HD combo section gives basics on what combos you can do that don't start with jumping or converting a certain situational into a big combo. I think with so many opportunities to get high damage, more players should be aware of what you can do to get into HD mode with K'.
Over the next few weeks, I'll go over the combos and tweak them so that they're current, organized, and optimized. I'll atleast include one practical combo and one challenging combo per bracket up to about 3 so when players improve, they don't have to stick with low damage/easy combos and can proceed into more powerful and difficult combos.
With Djmirror's permission, when time permitted, I'm going to get around to changing his notes into paragraph form as well as adding to it so the K' match-up section is more complete.
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Nice job Reiki! Good work. I like the situational HD combo section too, it's really useful to let people know of different ways to go into HD.
Is it possible you can add a legend to the combo section similar to this?:
http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=Kim_Kaphwan_%28XIII%29#Combos (http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=Kim_Kaphwan_%28XIII%29#Combos)
This is for people wont have to go back and forth between looking at the front page of the wiki incase they dont memorize the notation.
Also, is it possible for you can add damage values to his normal combos as well? And format his HD combo section similar to Kim's HD combo section too? You can keep the situational HD section the way it is.
Thanks again man...looking forward to his match-up section too. :)
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I'll start on the damages. Most of the combos have to be tweaked a little so that they still work.
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you have my permission but I want to double check/add more stuff.
After I finish doing K Dash, I might do Kula with ESB Sam and EX Iori with Kane317
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Added DJMirror949 as a contributor. Added Joe's matchup info, going to work on Leona later.
EDIT: Finished Leona and Duolon
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Added the following in the Tips section:
Frame Trap and Links
(L) = Link
1.) st. A, cl. C
2.) st. A, cr. C
3.) st. B, st. A
4.) st. B, cr. A
5.) st. B, st. B
6.) st. B, cr. B
7.) st. B, cl. C
8.) cr. B, cl. C
9.) qcf+AC, far C
10.) qcf+AC, far D
11.) qcf+AC, cr. D
12.) (corner) qcf+AC, cl. C
13.) (corner) qcf+AC, cl. D
14.) (corner) qcf+AC, CD
15.) (meaty) cl. qcf+C, cl. C (L)
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I added the following combos:
j.D -> d.B -> d.B -> qcf+AC -> f+D -> (delay) qcb+D -> qcb+K (miss) -> dp+C
j.CD -> j.qcb+BD -> dp+C
j.CD (Counter Hit) -> qcb+D -> qcb+K (miss) -> dp+A (2 hits)
j.CD (Counter Hit) -> j.CD -> j.qcb+BD ->dp+C
j.CD (Counter Hit) -> qcb+D -> qcb+K (miss) -> dp+A (1 hit) -> DC qcf+C (Corner) -> f+D -> f+A -> j.CD -> j.qcb+BD -> dp+C
When I have some time tonight I want to do some damage and stun values for the combos. Also, for whoever was working on the K' wiki originally, do you mind if I changed the combo notation so it's consistent with the other character wikis?
Changing things like '->' to ',' and 'd.X' to 'c.X'
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When I have some time tonight I want to do some damage and stun values for the combos. Also, for whoever was working on the K' wiki originally, do you mind if I changed the combo notation so it's consistent with the other character wikis?
Changing things like '->' to ',' and 'd.X' to 'c.X'
Thanks, and yes, please. I started at the 0 Drive Gauge and 0 Meter section and stopped there. Please.