Dream Cancel Forum

King of Fighters XIII => Character Discussion => Raiden => Topic started by: nilcam on July 27, 2010, 02:49:38 AM

Title: Raiden (Arcade Version)
Post by: nilcam on July 27, 2010, 02:49:38 AM
(http://i1005.photobucket.com/albums/af171/dreamcancel/kofxiii/raiden.gif)

Notation
;a = Light Punch
;b = Light Kick
;c = Strong Punch
;d = Strong Kick

* = EX version possible

Special Moves
Poison Mist - ;qcb + ;a / ;c *

Raiden Bomb - ;dp + ;a / ;c

Head Crusher - ;hcf + ;b / ;d (Close) *

Giant Bomb - (charge) ;db, ;fd + ;a / ;c
    ∟ ;a ;b (for feint)

DropKick - (charge) ;b / ;d ,release

Desperation Moves
Super Raiden Drop - ;hcb x2 + ;a / ;c (close)

Crazy Train Lariatoooo - ;qcf ;qcf + ;a / ;c

Neomax
Raiden Bomber - ;qcf ;qcf + ;b ;d


Raiden's Wiki entry (http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=Raiden_(XIII)).

Console changes:
- (shown in video) Weak Poison Breath has less lag. When it hits you can followup with his command throw
- Adjustments to Super Drop Kick (lol)
* Charge times have been increased.
* Invincibility removed
* Guard crush ability has been reduced
* Can no longer be connected after a guard cancel attack
* Knocks the opponent away.
- Jump Dís hitbox has been strengthened to hit downwards. It should whiff less often on short opponents
- (shown in video) Giant Bomb (feint) has less recovery
- EX Raiden Bombís forward travel distance has been reduced.
- (shown in video) Raiden Bomber now has complete invincibility.

Yamamoto Ė Although Super Dropkick has been weakened, shorter recovery on Giant Bomb Feint allows him to be played more trickily. With the improvement to his jump HK {j.D}, he has reliable attacks from the air leading to greater attack possibilities. Worthy of special mention, complete invincibility on Raiden Bomber means no more awkward looking trades.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: MUSOLINI on August 14, 2010, 05:38:03 PM
could somebody try this combo for me.

jump in hard attack, crouching hard or light pynch (whichever is cancelable), ex shoulder tackle, drop kick, standing A, drop kick, dp. instead of the dp, if you got more meter would it be possible to do another ex shoulder and juggle on? this should do HUGE damage. after the last drop kick instead of doing a dp do another ex shoulder, after that normal light shoulder if possible into nm, otherwise just go straight for the nm. dude does huge damage, this should be doing HARD damage.

somebody, anybody.

edit: raiden doesnt even have 1 ex dm?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: 4leaf on August 14, 2010, 10:36:55 PM
His EX DM is a throw. I was thinking do ex tackle instead of jab after the drop kicks. I'll be going in a bit to test it out.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: MUSOLINI on August 15, 2010, 03:41:44 AM
let me know what other possibilities you find out. he could be doing very easy beyond 100% combos if hes got some meter and drop kicks stored.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: t3h mAsTarOth...! on August 15, 2010, 04:45:45 AM
this drop kick stuff is cool and all... but i hope it doesn't turn into SC4 Hilde x10... cause i saw 1 of them doing 30%... and what's the time for charging them? cause NO meter double drop kick doing 70% is pretty OP...

practically thinking i would only charge 1 of them with D... so that i can have access to B which would allow me to cr.B and to cancel tackle and hcf.B...
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Rex Dart on August 15, 2010, 05:02:34 AM
His drop kick has four different levels.

Level 1: 4 seconds (slow)
Level 2: 8 seconds (slow)
Level 3: 12 seconds (medium)
Level 4: 16 seconds (fast)

There are other differences between the different versions, but I can't read the Japanese info on it.

Combo:

jCD -> LV3 or LV4 drop kick -> EX Giant Bomb -> Strong Giant Bomb -> Raiden Bomb (air grab)
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Remxi on August 15, 2010, 05:47:24 AM
According to the mook, the damage for the diff levels is as follows:

Level 1: 100
Level 2: 150
Level 3: 200
Level 4: 250

Perhaps there are also differences on guard? Like final level will allow a guard crush + followup?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on August 15, 2010, 11:08:17 AM
Don't know if this helps, here's a translate.google.com version of his levels:

Level 1: 4 sec Entertainment, occurred late, not invincible, after guard against substantial
Level 2: Entertainment 08 seconds, occurred late, a bit invincible, then guard against
Level 3: Entertainment 12s usually occur invincible determination to attack occurred, then guard against fine, whatever decision
Level 4: 16 sec Entertainment, early experience, offensive invincible determination to disappear, then guard against fine, whatever decision

---
Entertainment = charge
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: t3h mAsTarOth...! on August 15, 2010, 01:18:06 PM
ok so that seems A LOT more fair... a minimum of 12 second charge to get decent damage + invincibility + combo ability + be safe... and so yes in a real match it only seems viable to charge 1 button... otherwise you lack half your tools...

@Kane317 - LOL at that translation... what's even funnier is i actually understood what they meant...
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: 4leaf on August 15, 2010, 05:46:18 PM
Got to try Raiden yesterday but forgot to write down the damage for the combo I did.
Jump C, down C, ex tackle, down A, drop kick, down A, drop kick. ex poison or another ex tackle might work before the 2nd down A.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: MUSOLINI on August 15, 2010, 09:52:52 PM
you didnt try finishing with his nm? i wish you tried to do those ex tackles after the last dropkick, or at least his nm after it. if another ex tackle is possible, dayumn for posibilities. this would still hold the door open for his nm, cause youd still have 3 stocks after it and a full hd meter. the 12 second one might hurt a LOT.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on August 15, 2010, 10:02:17 PM
you didnt try finishing with his nm? i wish you tried to do those ex tackles after the last dropkick, or at least his nm after it. if another ex tackle is possible, dayumn for posibilities. this would still hold the door open for his nm, cause youd still have 3 stocks after it and a full hd meter. the 12 second one might hurt a LOT.

Well of course you can do the standard: s.A (as an anti air possibility as well), Max D Dropkick,  s.A, Max B Dropkick, NM.

To add to it, you want to charge to level 4 (Max) since it has much more range and better recovery, although level 3 does work.  In the meantime, you'll lose the ability to j.CD, crossup D, d.B combos, GCCDs, GCABs, AB roll, AB tech roll...

FYI: The Dune vids had a short training mode session with Raiden, seen here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-tdrBRiosU).
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: SHwoKing on August 18, 2010, 01:47:52 PM
Two french people living in Japan gave us some combos and info about Raiden :

Lvl 4 DropKick -> st. A -> Lvl 4 DropKick -> EX Giant Bomb -> Strong Poison Mist -> DC EX Giant Bomb -> Poison Mist -> Poison Mist -> Raiden Bomb

Damage should be around 950 and you need 1 Super meter (you'll gain another one while doing the combo) and 1/2 HD meter.

Also as Lvl 4 DropKick has free juggle properties, st. A / cr. A as anti-air can be followed by a DropKick even on normal hit.

And the best thing : Break CD can be chained with a B DropKick and follow-up, which is kinda scary.

Also some General info that i will probably post une the General discussion as well :
- If Joe is the Low Tier of this game, then, you don't have to worry about game's balance as he is still very dangerous.
- They talked about an Autoguard stuff : when your opponent cross-up you but sometimes still land in front of you (Kof XII player must know what i mean), if you guard the initial cross-up attempt then even if you guard on the wrong side while your opponent is attacking you with his ground attack, you will stay in guard.
- The Japanese KOF community seems to like KOF XIII and involved on the game.
In example, Ogosho said before that i didn't want to attend Kof XIII's Tougeki Qualification but they saw him attend few days after :D

Fixed some typos -Kane317
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: MUSOLINI on August 18, 2010, 05:48:51 PM
Lvl 4 DropKick -> st. A -> Lvl 4 DropKick -> EX Giant Bomb -> Strong Poison Mist -> DC EX Giant Bomb -> Poison Mist -> Poison Mist -> Raiden Bomb

this somewhat looks like the combo i mentioned but not quite.

jump in C -> cr. C -> EX giant bomb -> lvl 4 dropkick -> st. A -> lvl 4 dropkick -> EX giant bomb -> strong poison mist -> max cancel into neo max.

who knows, maybe instead of the strong poison mist its possible to do another no ex giant bomb, then poison mist into nm or just go straight to the nm from the giant bomb.

any of the ai folks wanna try this. i also asked at that kelvindj dude from yt to try it. gonna look now to see if theres anything new.

edit: it could be that theres a more damaging one if you start with the4 drop kick.

something like:

jump in C -> cr. C -> lvl 4 dropkick -> st. A -> lvl 4 dropkick -> EX giant bomb -> strong poison mist -> EX gaint bomb -> strong poison mist or non ex giant tackle max cancel into neo max.

since both combos have around the same length, the nm would probably do the same damage. but the damage on the drop kicks could mean extra damge if done earlier on. also if somebody's willing to try, finish the same combo without NM (for those instances without bar) and keep hd canceling with specials till you finish the combo with raiden bomb.

something else i thought of that might be interresting. after the first drop kick, since kick isnt used during the combos it might be possible to load another drop kick or 2 before finishing the combo. if the before mentioned combo is done, after the last ex giant bomb into strong poison mist it could be possible to do another drop kick and combo on into who knows what.

i wish i had this game, the combo possibilities are soo fucking wild in this game. more people need to hit up training mode, i know its hard for the ai folks cause theres only 1 machine. the owner must be happy with 13, i think its making good money for him.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on August 20, 2010, 05:25:52 PM
And the best thing : Break CD can be chained with a B DropKick and follow-up, which is kinda scary.

Lol tried the GCCD last night into drop, failed miserably.  Prolly shouldn't try it against the good players until I learned the timing here (last match). (http://www.mmcafe.com/nico.html#http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11814706)

(I also chose to test out the GP bug against K''s j.C, which in retrospect makes me think it's Kyo's s.C instead--all in the same match, big mistake lol.  Ate a long combo).

j.CD into drop kick is pretty juicy too.  It's tricky to choose which drop kick to store for (if you're only going for one) since d.B combos, AB rolling and tech rolling are pretty essential, whereas crossup D, GCCDs and j.CDs are equally useful.  I'm thinking storing the B is still the lesser of two evils.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: MUSOLINI on August 20, 2010, 06:04:23 PM
wow man looking at that vid makes me pretty sure the combo i said should be possible.


jump in C -> cr. C -> EX giant bomb -> lvl 4 dropkick -> st. A -> lvl 4 dropkick -> EX giant bomb -> giant bomb   -> max cancel into neo max.

jump in C -> cr. C -> lvl 4 dropkick -> st. A -> lvl 4 dropkick -> EX giant bomb -> combo into normal gaintbomb and go to nm or keep on comboing without nm, but with use of drive cancels and ex moves.

he has those drop kicks charged hes a real menace if he gets a hit in. especially a crouching C.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on August 21, 2010, 04:49:18 PM
Combos from Arcadia:
1/ d.B x1~2, s.A, Head Crusher (hcf+K)
2/ j.D, d.C, Ex qcb P, A Giant Bomb (charge db~f+P), [DC] Raiden Bomb (dp+P)
3/ Air.j.CD, Drop Kick (lvl 3~4), Ex Giant Bomb, (corner) Raiden Bomb
4/ (Corner) Air.j.CD, Drop Kick (lvl 3~4), Ex Giant Bomb, [DC] C Poison Mist (qcb+C), Ex Giant Bomb/ A Giant Bomb, Raiden Bomb

HD:
- s.D [2hits], HD, d.C, (Ex Giant Bomb, [HDC] C Poison Mist, A Giant Bomb, [HDC] C Poison Mist) x2, Ex Giant Bomb, [HDC] C Poison Mist,  A Giant Bomb, Raiden Bomb ~ 788 damage, 3 stocks, near corner

-d.C, HD, d.C, Ex Giant Bomb, [HDC] C Poison Mist, A Giant Bomb, [HDC] C Poison Mist, d.C, Max Drop Kick, Ex Giant Bomb, [HDC] C Poison Mist, A Giant Bomb, Raiden Bomb ~ 1029 damage, 2 stocks, near corner
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: MUSOLINI on August 21, 2010, 06:08:34 PM
nice combos, but i think he could do way more damage for those non hd mode ones.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on September 01, 2010, 04:28:12 PM
Finally got it translated courtesy of PS over at ON:

Stage 1: Charge time 4 seconds. Time before attack comes out: Slow. Invincibility: None. On block frame disadvantage: HUGE. 100 damage.
Stage 2: Charge time 8 seconds. Time before attack comes out: Slow. Invincibility: slight, before attack comes out. On block frame disadvantage: Medium. 150 damage.
Stage 3: Charge time 12 seconds. Time before attack comes out: Normal. Invincibility: Until right after kick comes out. On block frame disadvantage: slight. Has all juggle property. 200 damage.
Stage 4: Charge time 16 seconds. Time before attack comes out: Fast. Invincibility: All throughout move. On block frame disadvantage: slight. Has all juggle property. 250 damage.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: MUSOLINI on September 01, 2010, 07:09:43 PM
aight, nice. already saw a nice combo on those nico vids without going hd.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: l2slythe on October 17, 2010, 02:00:08 AM
Alright guys, Raiden has changed since the new patch. They've definitely changed the charge times for lvl3 and lvl4 Dropkicks. Mr. KoF says that level 3 dropkick will only work after 16+? secs after holding the button. And lvl4 will work after 25+? secs. You guys still think he's top tier?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: PureYeti on October 17, 2010, 02:19:31 AM
Somewhat, how easy was it to hold 16+ secs?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: l2slythe on October 17, 2010, 02:31:13 AM
Not as easy as you would think 'holding down 2 buttons' is. There are only 3 people at AI that use Raiden, we all agree he's not the biggest threat in the game. He's not even on par with K'. Then again, these are the opinions of the people who actually know how to use Raiden.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on October 17, 2010, 07:07:21 AM
Not as easy as you would think 'holding down 2 buttons' is. There are only 3 people at AI that use Raiden, we all agree he's not the biggest threat in the game. He's not even on par with K'. Then again, these are the opinions of the people who actually know how to use Raiden.

It's a damn shame too, I REALLY wanted to use Raiden this year but I probably won't touch him until they tone him down, too distasteful for my taste.

Edit: Didn't read about his charge time increase...most interesting.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Violent Ryo on October 18, 2010, 03:58:56 AM
Not as easy as you would think 'holding down 2 buttons' is. There are only 3 people at AI that use Raiden, we all agree he's not the biggest threat in the game. He's not even on par with K'. Then again, these are the opinions of the people who actually know how to use Raiden.

It's a damn shame too, I REALLY wanted to use Raiden this year but I probably won't touch him until they tone him down, too distasteful for my taste.

Edit: Didn't read about his charge time increase...most interesting.

Raiden is one of my mains in KOF XII, so was planning on using him for KOF XIII. 


My suggestion, just don't use the drop kicks?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Chowdizzle on October 19, 2010, 02:12:39 PM
I've been watching some archive of a KoF XIII tourney between a bunch of Japanese players (I'm assuming) and Raiden really looks like the Sentinel of this game considering of the 10 players (not the actual number just an estimate) it seemed like 8 of them had him on their team. I can understand why, though I don't want to use him when I get the chance to play simply because his techniques are insane and the fact that once you have the charge an anti air jab can lead to...full health lol.

With that aside I've been thinking about how you are supposed to shut him down with strong offense to beat him and while watching the vids I never once saw him hop. My question is does he not have a hop? If not that's good, that seems like it'd be balanced.

Should be clear with this comment that I haven't played a whole lot of KoF. I'm extremely interested though!
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Mr.KOF on October 19, 2010, 02:29:45 PM
Not as easy as you would think 'holding down 2 buttons' is. There are only 3 people at AI that use Raiden, we all agree he's not the biggest threat in the game. He's not even on par with K'. Then again, these are the opinions of the people who actually know how to use Raiden.

Preach On Brotha! Even after eating two or three drop kicks per game...i can safely say i can still win. I'd love to play anyones Raiden besides Reynald's.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: TYRANNICAL on October 19, 2010, 08:05:37 PM
With that aside I've been thinking about how you are supposed to shut him down with strong offense to beat him and while watching the vids I never once saw him hop. My question is does he not have a hop? If not that's good, that seems like it'd be balanced.
Raiden does have a hop. Everyone in KOF(not counting bosses) does.  If he didn't have a hop people would turtle him hardcore and he'd have to use Drop Kicks and shoulder charge to close the distance.  Running is not that fast in this KOF from what I've seen.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: MUSOLINI on October 19, 2010, 09:00:20 PM
soo some balancing was done? how long do you have to charge now? also, other changes?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Chowdizzle on October 20, 2010, 12:01:23 AM
With that aside I've been thinking about how you are supposed to shut him down with strong offense to beat him and while watching the vids I never once saw him hop. My question is does he not have a hop? If not that's good, that seems like it'd be balanced.
Raiden does have a hop. Everyone in KOF(not counting bosses) does.  If he didn't have a hop people would turtle him hardcore and he'd have to use Drop Kicks and shoulder charge to close the distance.  Running is not that fast in this KOF from what I've seen.

Okay, TY. If the 25 second charge in the update is true then that seems to me to be much more balanced. pretty much if you miss one the option is gone. You can combo with the lvl 3 out of a jab still though?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: MUSOLINI on October 28, 2010, 07:36:04 AM
when this page also gets the update add dropkick levels with amount of time needed fot that level (did the amount of time change or not?) an d the damage each level does.

all this info should really be welcome for anybody thats been thinking of getting into 13.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on October 28, 2010, 08:18:34 AM
when this page also gets the update add dropkick levels with amount of time needed fot that level (did the amount of time change or not?) an d the damage each level does.

all this info should really be welcome for anybody thats been thinking of getting into 13.

I think it's hard to test it now that most ppl have v1.1  The only thing we can do is to get someone to test it in v1.0 (France still has 1.0) in training mode with the exact same timer setting, and get someone else to test it in v1.1.

More and more reports are still saying the DK are the same including the Professor (mmcafe) person recent report over in Japan.  I wish my AI friends were right but I'm pretty sure they're not.

---
Watching the latest set of KCE (around 398ish), I am convinced entirely that Raiden is best played with just the D button held.  You lose his awesome crossup but you still can cancel off of his d.B, s.B into SDM; d.B, d.A into DM; d.B, d.A into hcf+K; or d.B, s.B, Dropkick into Ex Tackle x2 and so forth.  You still can do his GCDK shenanigans so you only really lose his crossup D minimizing his losses.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Rex Dart on October 28, 2010, 03:42:17 PM
Watching the latest set of KCE (around 398ish), I am convinced entirely that Raiden is best played with just the D button held.  You lose his awesome crossup but you still can cancel off of his d.B, s.B into SDM; d.B, d.A into DM; d.B, d.A into hcf+K; or d.B, s.B, Dropkick into Ex Tackle x2 and so forth.  You still can do his GCDK shenanigans so you only really lose his crossup D minimizing his losses.
By holding D you also lose his overhead, which was used to great effect in some of the videos. s.D -> HD -> cr. C -> shoulder tackle shenanigans -> so much death.

What most struck me about the recent videos is that Raiden is, even if they were to nerf his dropkicks, is an incredibly solid character. Great normals, ridiculous damage output, excellent defense, etc. Most people have just been playing him a gimmick character, but he's even more dangerous as an all-around character.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: THE ANSWER on October 28, 2010, 05:34:27 PM
On one of the last vids I saw a 95% combo and the guy only charge the DKs for only 10-11 seconds. That's just plain stupid.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on October 28, 2010, 06:04:59 PM
By holding D you also lose his overhead, which was used to great effect in some of the videos. s.D -> HD -> cr. C -> shoulder tackle shenanigans -> so much death.

What most struck me about the recent videos is that Raiden is, even if they were to nerf his dropkicks, is an incredibly solid character. Great normals, ridiculous damage output, excellent defense, etc. Most people have just been playing him a gimmick character, but he's even more dangerous as an all-around character.

I'm confident now, with the Professor's personal reports among others, that the dropkicks have not changed.  They did not get nerfed. 

On one of the last vids I saw a 95% combo and the guy only charge the DKs for only 10-11 seconds. That's just plain stupid.

I dunno which one you're referring to as I watched all of them, but I'm sure it was a lvl3 12 sec drop.  Was it a double Ex Tackle?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: MUSOLINI on October 28, 2010, 06:22:03 PM
damn, thats  a shame. also who is the one changing the character threada with the added info? nill or kk123? one of you should hit up the takuma thread and see my post about what can be improved for these threads.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on October 28, 2010, 06:42:04 PM
damn, thats  a shame. also who is the one changing the character threada with the added info? nill or kk123? one of you should hit up the takuma thread and see my post about what can be improved for these threads.

You know, we all could post information ourselves instead of letting kk123 and nilcam do 90% of the work. 
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: THE ANSWER on October 28, 2010, 06:50:43 PM
By holding D you also lose his overhead, which was used to great effect in some of the videos. s.D -> HD -> cr. C -> shoulder tackle shenanigans -> so much death.

What most struck me about the recent videos is that Raiden is, even if they were to nerf his dropkicks, is an incredibly solid character. Great normals, ridiculous damage output, excellent defense, etc. Most people have just been playing him a gimmick character, but he's even more dangerous as an all-around character.

I'm confident now, with the Professor's personal reports among others, that the dropkicks have not changed.  They did not get nerfed. 

On one of the last vids I saw a 95% combo and the guy only charge the DKs for only 10-11 seconds. That's just plain stupid.

I dunno which one you're referring to as I watched all of them, but I'm sure it was a lvl3 12 sec drop.  Was it a double Ex Tackle?

yes
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: MUSOLINI on October 29, 2010, 12:40:36 AM
damn, thats  a shame. also who is the one changing the character threada with the added info? nill or kk123? one of you should hit up the takuma thread and see my post about what can be improved for these threads.

You know, we all could post information ourselves instead of letting kk123 and nilcam do 90% of the work. 

its not possible to modify other peoples posts. and i only got acces to 13 from vids, only info i can get is from what other people do on these vids. if i was actually playing the game...
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on October 29, 2010, 02:10:24 AM
damn, thats  a shame. also who is the one changing the character threada with the added info? nill or kk123? one of you should hit up the takuma thread and see my post about what can be improved for these threads.

You know, we all could post information ourselves instead of letting kk123 and nilcam do 90% of the work.  

its not possible to modify other peoples posts. and i only got acces to 13 from vids, only info i can get is from what other people do on these vids. if i was actually playing the game...

You do realize that neither does kk123, doesn't stop him from posting.  He makes an effort to search BBS, I want to say over 50% of the combos I post are from BBS that I can't read either and I go thru translate.google.com, then go to my Mook that I can't read, match the words that didn't get translated correctly, then post.  You can learn a lot from the videos as well.  It's all about making an effort to help the community. =)

---
In other news, this is the second post that Professor has made about it in 2 days:

Quote
[Edit] I keep getting mails asking if Raiden's dropkick takes longer to charge in KOFXIIIVer1.1-- quick answer is no, it's still real-time 12s for Lv3 and 16s for Lv4.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: krazykone123 on October 31, 2010, 06:59:19 PM
Raiden XIII wiki is done, I think it turned out quite nice imo

questions/comments/suggestions?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Rex Dart on October 31, 2010, 07:35:37 PM
Looks really good. Two small criticisms:

Under pros, you list:
- Top Tier
- When mastered he can OCV a whole team on his own

I think a list of pros should explain why a character is top tier, rather than simply state that he is on top. So I don't think that's really necessary. Also, saying a character can "OCV" "on his own" is a bit redundant.

And one question, which doesn't specifically relate to the Raiden page:

Is it alright to be using scans from the mook? I just want to check that whoever owns DC.com isn't worried about receiving a C&D from some Japanese lawyers.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: nilcam on October 31, 2010, 07:55:10 PM
The usage of these images in the wiki should be covered by fair usage since we are nit just displaying scanned pages, the audience is different than the targeted audience and the information provided is factual. If we get a C&D, we'll remove the scanned bits.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: krazykone123 on November 01, 2010, 04:48:11 AM
Looks really good. Two small criticisms:

Under pros, you list:
- Top Tier
- When mastered he can OCV a whole team on his own

I think a list of pros should explain why a character is top tier, rather than simply state that he is on top. So I don't think that's really necessary. Also, saying a character can "OCV" "on his own" is a bit redundant.

Sorry, I was having a little too much fun writing up his page, removed
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: EasyPie on November 01, 2010, 05:09:12 AM
We have a wiki here? May direct me to it please?

Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: nilcam on November 01, 2010, 05:55:39 AM
http://dreamcancel.com/wiki
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: EasyPie on November 01, 2010, 06:18:38 AM
Many Thanks, nilcam.

Raiden doesn't need any command moves, he's not incompetent like the rest of the cast.


Sobs...
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: krazykone123 on November 01, 2010, 10:53:03 PM

Raiden doesn't need any command moves, he's not incompetent like the rest of the cast.


Sobs...

Haha sorry I just had too, anyone else got any requests regarding the wiki page?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: EasyPie on November 02, 2010, 10:10:45 AM
Yes, an animated streamlined moves performed by that Fighter.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Demoninja on April 21, 2011, 01:47:39 AM
So I was reading the Drive Cancel podcast thread and someone mentioned doing GCCD into double dropkicks. Did you mean doing a GCCD, DK lvl 4, st. A, DK lvl 4? If so how would that work? How can you do the GCCD while holding D for the DK?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on April 21, 2011, 02:44:05 AM
So I was reading the Drive Cancel podcast thread and someone mentioned doing GCCD into double dropkicks. Did you mean doing a GCCD, DK lvl 4, st. A, DK lvl 4? If so how would that work? How can you do the GCCD while holding D for the DK?

I mentioned it on that thread.  It's a tricky thing to pull off but you hold down the two kicks as you would normally, wait for that block frame, and very quickly release the D (while holding the B of course still) and press CD at the same time.  The JBBS says that ppl find it easier to have the C pressed down as well and then quickly release the CD and press it immediately.  The timing is pretty tight as you can imagine otherwise they would not suggest you to hold down the C as well.

GCCD into double dropkicks is so dirty.

So with that logic, I think it was only a couple days or maybe a week later, their were reports of ppl using both Raiden's kick like normal and then immediately going into a lvl4 dropkick haha.  Good thing we haven't seen much of that.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: l2slythe on April 21, 2011, 08:37:56 PM
Been playing with Raiden w/out dropkicks and tested out an HD combo during a match playing against John.

s. ;c, HD, d. ;c  ; ;dn ;db ;bk ;a ;c (spit),  (;db ;fd ;a ;c,  ;dn  ;db ;bk ;c) 3x. that did about 80% without the last spit.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on April 21, 2011, 08:40:42 PM
Been playing with Raiden w/out dropkicks and tested out an HD combo during a match playing against John.

s. ;c, HD, d. ;c  ; ;dn ;db ;bk ;a ;c (spit),  (;db ;fd ;a ;c,  ;dn  ;db ;bk ;c) 3x. that did about 80% without the last spit.

That's why I always say it's such a "shame" since I used Raiden in XII as I liked his design and gameplay, plus he does seem pretty fun, but atlas in his current form I refuse to play him.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Demoninja on April 21, 2011, 08:43:43 PM
I'm just trying to be as cheap as possible so this GCCD double dropkick sounds like it mustbe learned haha. So to clarify, I release to CD, then the D dropkick comes out?

If there's a tourney or something here I want to be ready to pick K' Raiden whoever likes everyone else. Only exception is I have to be 3x dirtier.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Ash on April 21, 2011, 08:49:15 PM
Been playing with Raiden w/out dropkicks and tested out an HD combo during a match playing against John.

s. ;c, HD, d. ;c  ; ;dn ;db ;bk ;a ;c (spit),  (;db ;fd ;a ;c,  ;dn  ;db ;bk ;c) 3x. that did about 80% without the last spit.

That's why I always say it's such a "shame" since I used Raiden in XII as I liked his design and gameplay, plus he does seem pretty fun, but atlas in his current form I refuse to play him.

You can just play him without doing drop kicks
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: l2slythe on April 21, 2011, 10:24:26 PM
Been playing with Raiden w/out dropkicks and tested out an HD combo during a match playing against John.

s. ;c, HD, d. ;c  ; ;dn ;db ;bk ;a ;c (spit),  (;db ;fd ;a ;c,  ;dn  ;db ;bk ;c) 3x. that did about 80% without the last spit.

That's why I always say it's such a "shame" since I used Raiden in XII as I liked his design and gameplay, plus he does seem pretty fun, but atlas in his current form I refuse to play him.

You can just play him without doing drop kicks

I agree, you should watch me play against john without dropkicks. its pretty fun.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: FataCon on April 21, 2011, 10:28:23 PM
I'm just trying to be as cheap as possible so this GCCD double dropkick sounds like it mustbe learned haha. So to clarify, I release to CD, then the D dropkick comes out?

If there's a tourney or something here I want to be ready to pick K' Raiden whoever likes everyone else. Only exception is I have to be 3x dirtier.

NorCal KoF scene = :(

On topic though, I also liked Raiden in XII.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Ash on April 21, 2011, 10:31:15 PM
Been playing with Raiden w/out dropkicks and tested out an HD combo during a match playing against John.

s. ;c, HD, d. ;c  ; ;dn ;db ;bk ;a ;c (spit),  (;db ;fd ;a ;c,  ;dn  ;db ;bk ;c) 3x. that did about 80% without the last spit.

That's why I always say it's such a "shame" since I used Raiden in XII as I liked his design and gameplay, plus he does seem pretty fun, but atlas in his current form I refuse to play him.

You can just play him without doing drop kicks

I agree, you should watch me play against john without dropkicks. its pretty fun.

I'm actually considering learning him, because I remember I had a lot of fun with him in XII. It's always good to learn characters so I can learn how to play against them better as well. That means I should start playing K' Raiden Elizabeth hahahah
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on April 21, 2011, 11:07:47 PM
I'm just trying to be as cheap as possible so this GCCD double dropkick sounds like it mustbe learned haha. So to clarify, I release to CD, then the D dropkick comes out?

Yeah the times I got it off I remember holding BCD (lol), releasing CD for a split second and then pressing CD again, then quickly release them both and the D dropkick should come out.

You can just play him without doing drop kicks

Bleh, I dunno, something about that restriction feels funny to me plus there's enough characters right now to keep me interested.  Maybe after I get better with DL.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Ash on April 21, 2011, 11:20:22 PM
I'm just trying to be as cheap as possible so this GCCD double dropkick sounds like it mustbe learned haha. So to clarify, I release to CD, then the D dropkick comes out?

Yeah the times I got it off I remember holding BCD (lol), releasing CD for a split second and then pressing CD again, then quickly release them both and the D dropkick should come out.

You can just play him without doing drop kicks

Bleh, I dunno, something about that restriction feels funny to me plus there's enough characters right now to keep me interested.  Maybe after I get better with DL.

Sounds like reversal to me hahah. At the beginning I wouldn't switch characters so I can get better with my mains while you were trying a bunch.

Well, you can think about it this way, not trying out a character is more of a restriction than not using a character at all.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Demoninja on April 21, 2011, 11:33:53 PM
I know I said pick Raiden and K like everyone else but I don't know who here can actually use Raiden without holding D/B an waiting for the lvl 4. I usually only charge one DK when I use him.

Is light spit punishable on block?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on April 21, 2011, 11:37:12 PM
I'm just trying to be as cheap as possible so this GCCD double dropkick sounds like it mustbe learned haha. So to clarify, I release to CD, then the D dropkick comes out?

Yeah the times I got it off I remember holding BCD (lol), releasing CD for a split second and then pressing CD again, then quickly release them both and the D dropkick should come out.

You can just play him without doing drop kicks

Bleh, I dunno, something about that restriction feels funny to me plus there's enough characters right now to keep me interested.  Maybe after I get better with DL.

Sounds like reversal to me hahah. At the beginning I wouldn't switch characters so I can get better with my mains while you were trying a bunch.

Well, you can think about it this way, not trying out a character is more of a restriction than not using a character at all.

If the rooster was smaller I might rethink my stubborn ways, but I think it's ok if I don't use Raiden since there's tons of characters for me to learn still.  Basically, I ask myself, "how badly do I want to win?"  If I was in HK I'd might think twice, coz some of those bastards definitely need a dropkick to their face, but with friends I don't feel that I need to win that badly lols.  In some ways, I feel that playing over here has definitely soften me up but I have a lot more fun here.    

You know my gamestyle, I like implementing everything that the character has and really enjoy using the full range of tools; if I had to restrict myself it would just feel weird.  I'm sure I'll use Raiden once more soon.  

Is light spit punishable on block?

If I remember correctly yes, in fact, I think it was the C version that was safe on block if you time it correctly (especially on wake up)--the drawback of course is that it's slower to start up.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Ash on April 22, 2011, 12:40:59 AM
I'm just trying to be as cheap as possible so this GCCD double dropkick sounds like it mustbe learned haha. So to clarify, I release to CD, then the D dropkick comes out?

Yeah the times I got it off I remember holding BCD (lol), releasing CD for a split second and then pressing CD again, then quickly release them both and the D dropkick should come out.

You can just play him without doing drop kicks

Bleh, I dunno, something about that restriction feels funny to me plus there's enough characters right now to keep me interested.  Maybe after I get better with DL.

Sounds like reversal to me hahah. At the beginning I wouldn't switch characters so I can get better with my mains while you were trying a bunch.

Well, you can think about it this way, not trying out a character is more of a restriction than not using a character at all.

If the rooster was smaller I might rethink my stubborn ways, but I think it's ok if I don't use Raiden since there's tons of characters for me to learn still.  Basically, I ask myself, "how badly do I want to win?"  If I was in HK I'd might think twice, coz some of those bastards definitely need a dropkick to their face, but with friends I don't feel that I need to win that badly lols.  In some ways, I feel that playing over here has definitely soften me up but I have a lot more fun here.   

You know my gamestyle, I like implementing everything that the character has and really enjoy using the full range of tools; if I had to restrict myself it would just feel weird.  I'm sure I'll use Raiden once more soon. 


I can understand there's plenty characters to use, but I'd like to point out that even if someone did use Raiden (or K' for the matter) that they wouldn't win a lot more just a little bit more. SF4 has a lot of character match ups that are bad, but according to their match up percentages, most advantages fall at 60%/40%. Since KOF has a lesser impact on character match ups, it would be even less than this.

The more I think about it, even if I did use a complete top tier team, I would probably still lose/win against the same people nearly at the same percentage rate with only a small increase. I think I may just try it out for a couple of weeks and see if it even does make much of a difference.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Demoninja on April 22, 2011, 02:56:21 AM
In my brief experience with KOF, the team really didn't matter too much. When I was on point, I wa winning regardless of who I used but when I wasn't playing well, even a completely top tier team didn't help.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: a11111357 on April 30, 2011, 05:06:16 PM
YouTube - KOFXIII character combo Raiden (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMIGODBXGp4)
YouTube - KOF XIII Raiden 100% combos (drop kick) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSFooe1OsVg)
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: MUSOLINI on May 01, 2011, 04:25:26 AM
wow that last raiden combo was real nice. shoulder into ex shoulder twice into nm.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Demoninja on May 05, 2011, 01:44:46 AM
Man I still haven't gotten regular CD into B Drop kick yet, what's the point of trying to get the GCCD double drop kick right now haha. Do I let go of DK right after the GCCD?
Title: Has anyone at the former Arcade Infinity did this?
Post by: Homies Over Shotos on July 09, 2011, 10:18:35 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFm5xqRs45o&NR=1

I never seen anyone do that in any AI video, but is it possible to basically go through anything with a fierce shoulder tackle?  That wasn't even EX'd and it still went through King's DM like Athena to a donut shop in XII.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on July 09, 2011, 11:36:15 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFm5xqRs45o&NR=1

I never seen anyone do that in any AI video, but is it possible to basically go through anything with a fierce shoulder tackle?  That wasn't even EX'd and it still went through King's DM like Athena to a donut shop in XII.

No need to start an entire topic just for that question. 

His tackle has guardpoint (autoguard), there shouldn't be any surprise as GPs guard any hitbased moved in KOF as usual.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Homies Over Shotos on July 10, 2011, 02:58:15 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFm5xqRs45o&NR=1

I never seen anyone do that in any AI video, but is it possible to basically go through anything with a fierce shoulder tackle?  That wasn't even EX'd and it still went through King's DM like Athena to a donut shop in XII.

No need to start an entire topic just for that question. 

His tackle has guardpoint (autoguard), there shouldn't be any surprise as GPs guard any hitbased moved in KOF as usual.

I know the move has autoguard, but how long is his autoguard?  And doesn't it usually fade after a hit or two?

I just find it so funny that his regular tackle trolled a DM that connected first and hit twice yet, he didn't even take any damage on the two hits that did connect.

In KOF 12, I believe that Goro's autoguard still made him take damage through a few hits.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on July 10, 2011, 06:44:35 AM
He might have two or more GuardPoints.  It just looks crazier because the tackle travels as well.  All GPs in XIII take nono damage to the user.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: LouisCipher on October 03, 2011, 06:53:45 PM
Quick question, sure it's an easy answer: Is Raiden's Shoulder charge safe on block? Are both version safe or just the B version? Thanks.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on October 03, 2011, 09:50:29 PM
Quick question, sure it's an easy answer: Is Raiden's Shoulder charge safe on block? Are both version safe or just the B version? Thanks.

Neither:  -6/-16/-10 frames for the A/C/EX versions.  However, you have to factor in pushback etc...
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: LouisCipher on October 04, 2011, 04:17:38 AM
Good to know, thanks. There goes using Raiden's Shoulder Charge like Alex's Shoulder in 3S.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: bigvador on October 04, 2011, 04:23:22 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFm5xqRs45o&NR=1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFm5xqRs45o&NR=1)

I never seen anyone do that in any AI video, but is it possible to basically go through anything with a fierce shoulder tackle?  That wasn't even EX'd and it still went through King's DM like Athena to a donut shop in XII.

No need to start an entire topic just for that question. 

His tackle has guardpoint (autoguard), there shouldn't be any surprise as GPs guard any hitbased moved in KOF as usual.

dosnt it have auto guard through out the hole move like in XII
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: LouisCipher on October 04, 2011, 07:52:00 AM
So can you use his Shoulder to counter a one hit move or does it go through the multi-hitters?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: bigvador on October 04, 2011, 08:29:32 AM
multiple i believe and i wanna say the timing of it too cause it may not have auto guard all the way through
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Demoninja on October 04, 2011, 10:10:26 AM
So does GCCD into D dropkick still work in console?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Reiki.Kito on October 04, 2011, 10:22:47 AM
The only properties of the dropkick that are changing are that the super drop kick's charge time is increased and it will push people away. You should be able to GCCD Dropkick still, you just won't be able to combo it out of the corner anymore.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on October 04, 2011, 11:23:44 AM
The only properties of the dropkick that are changing are that the super drop kick's charge time is increased and it will push people away. You should be able to GCCD Dropkick still, you just won't be able to combo it out of the corner anymore.

If I remember correctly, No. 17 asked Yamamoto-San and he said they removed that ability (GCCD --> DK).
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Reiki.Kito on October 04, 2011, 12:19:26 PM
Might wanna put that up in the changes cause that'd be important for people to know too.

As far as I knew, it was just the Super Drop Kick that changed, not his normals.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Kane317 on November 01, 2011, 06:26:06 AM
First page has been updated with console changes.

---
- (shown in video) Weak Poison Breath has less lag. When it hits you can followup with his command throw
- Adjustments to Super Drop Kick (lol)
* Charge times have been increased.
* Invincibility removed
* Guard crush ability has been reduced
* Can no longer be connected after a guard cancel attack
* Knocks the opponent away.
- Jump Dís hitbox has been strengthened to hit downwards. It should whiff less often on short opponents
- (shown in video) Giant Bomb (feint) has less recovery
- EX Raiden Bombís forward travel distance has been reduced.
- (shown in video) Raiden Bomber now has complete invincibility.

Yamamoto Ė Although Super Dropkick has been weakened, shorter recovery on Giant Bomb Feint allows him to be played more trickily. With the improvement to his jump HK {j.D}, he has reliable attacks from the air leading to greater attack possibilities. Worthy of special mention, complete invincibility on Raiden Bomber means no more awkward looking trades.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: LouisCipher on November 01, 2011, 04:05:25 PM
So just checking but Super Drop Kick is now almost completely pointless, right?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: SAB-CA on November 01, 2011, 05:49:29 PM
So just checking but Super Drop Kick is now almost completely pointless, right?

I'd say it's a completly viable, super-damaging option, ESPECIALLY to charge up a single one. But the amount of time it takes to charge up 2 will take away SO many other solid options from Raiden now, that praying for a corner to get the double-drop on the opponent is probably actually worthless, yup.

Reminds me of Kushnood / Marco. If you charged up his Ultra-punch or ultra-kick, and which you should pick, by which options you wanted available to you over the match.

I like the kick not being Braindead-derpy now, lol. It'll now be a suprise to see an actual DK used, but with his other options being strengthened so much, I think it's still a VERY powerful took to have, on a character that would be 100% solid without it.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Rex Dart on November 01, 2011, 07:42:05 PM
Combos in XIII are still pretty long, to the point that the console version is trying to encourage shorter combos. And if you're getting hit with a 12 second long combo, may as well charge those DKs! I think they'll be pretty useful as punishers.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: sibarraz on November 19, 2011, 05:42:52 PM
Using any of his command grabs as a follow up to the poison mist is really easy to hit confirm, with one bar, you can do 313 of damage which is not bad

Overall, his dropkick now only works in the corner, I don't know if will be worth it to wait 32 seconds to do it, but oh well, he is still a beast imo
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: AmedÝ310 on November 28, 2011, 10:19:15 PM
Did someone mentioned that charge time can be carried over each round?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Reiki.Kito on November 28, 2011, 10:46:21 PM
No, but you can charge as at the beginning of the next round. Like when the announcer is saying "Ready" and stuff, you can charge then.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Tofu Warrior on November 30, 2011, 12:00:16 AM
Using any of his command grabs as a follow up to the poison mist is really easy to hit confirm, with one bar, you can do 313 of damage which is not bad

Overall, his dropkick now only works in the corner, I don't know if will be worth it to wait 32 seconds to do it, but oh well, he is still a beast imo

The charge time for a Level 4 DK has been increased to 32 seconds? I don't have the game yet, so pardon my ignorance. It seems like Atlus really wants to discourage players from using this move. Considering follow ups are corner only, I'm not sure if it's worth going half a round without one of your buttons, but only time will tell. The buffs he received are substantial though.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: BioBooster on November 30, 2011, 01:29:58 AM
Yep, 32s for lv 4. They wanted to curb the abuse. Although it's at 32 you still get most of the arcade the benefits, and since kicks have to be held down for double the time, it encourages players to leave one of the kicks free which allows Raiden to deepen his grappler play. That said, the lower levels of DK have plenty of utility and are still a great asset.

In exchange, they improved some of his normals like his j.D and made it so that he can combo off of poison breath.

I think they did a pretty good job in fixing what was broke. What's great is that his NM is actually worth doing now damage/cost wise and imo looks awesome. Just flipping a guy in the air off of a lariat with all the cool dust effects -DAAAAAAAH!!!
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Diavle on November 30, 2011, 03:05:46 PM
Tried him in my team and this character is pretty damn solid, victories and OCVs right of the bat.

Damn near all his normals are really good, hit hard and seemingly have great priority. Standing C, c.C, s.D, cr. and s. A, cr.B, everthing was hitting and stuffing really well.

His A and B have suprisingly good stun so you have a lot of time to combo with a grab or EX Tackle.

Speaking of the EX Tackle, its the reason I started using him second. So freaking good. Combos easily and takes straight to the corner from really far distances, which is where you can drive cancel into poison mist and then juggle with as many EX Tackle as you want before finishing it with the Bomber. So much damage, so easy. You can even go straight into a Neomax after that first tackle.

When they say in the change log that the Bomber (dp+P) is completely invincible, do they mean just the EX version or the regular one as well?

His regular tackle is very useful as well, great against fireball whores. There is autoguard just on the starting animation right? Is it full body autoguard or just upper like Maxima?

His neomax hits so deliciously hard.


So glad they brought him down to mortal status, I've really liked his look/design ever since seeing him in XII.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Tofu Warrior on November 30, 2011, 06:26:11 PM
Sorry, the invincibility was added to Raiden Bomber (QCFx2 B+D), not Raiden Bomb!  :) The names of those moves really shouldn't be that similar...

Yep, 32s for lv 4. They wanted to curb the abuse. Although it's at 32 you still get most of the arcade the benefits, and since kicks have to be held down for double the time, it encourages players to leave one of the kicks free which allows Raiden to deepen his grappler play. That said, the lower levels of DK have plenty of utility and are still a great asset.

Would you care to elaborate on this please? According to the KOF XIII Wiki, the Level 4 Drop Kick is the only one worth using, I'm curious to hear why you think the lower levels are useful as well. Also do you happen to know if the charge times were increased for Levels 1 - 3?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Diavle on November 30, 2011, 06:43:14 PM
Sorry, the invincibility was added to Raiden Bomber (QCFx2 B+D), not Raiden Bomb!  :) The names of those moves really shouldn't be that similar...

Oh, thanks man.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Tofu Warrior on December 01, 2011, 11:14:25 PM
Also this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFm5xqRs45o#ws) should answer your question about Raiden's  ;c Shoulder Tackle.
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Raynex on December 02, 2011, 12:25:22 AM
Also this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFm5xqRs45o#ws) should answer your question about Raiden's  ;c Shoulder Tackle.

LOL that looks hilarious. No chance!
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: Tofu Warrior on December 02, 2011, 05:12:25 AM
The video I posted got me thinking; is it possible to absorb an attack with the autoguard frames of  ;c Shoulder Tackle, then cancel it with a feint to put yourself at a frame advantage? In some cases, you might even be able to punish your opponent. This is pure theorycrafting on my part, would someone be kind enough to test it? :D
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: BioBooster on December 06, 2011, 03:51:46 AM
Sorry, the invincibility was added to Raiden Bomber (QCFx2 B+D), not Raiden Bomb!  :) The names of those moves really shouldn't be that similar...

Yep, 32s for lv 4. They wanted to curb the abuse. Although it's at 32 you still get most of the arcade the benefits, and since kicks have to be held down for double the time, it encourages players to leave one of the kicks free which allows Raiden to deepen his grappler play. That said, the lower levels of DK have plenty of utility and are still a great asset.

Would you care to elaborate on this please? According to the KOF XIII Wiki, the Level 4 Drop Kick is the only one worth using, I'm curious to hear why you think the lower levels are useful as well. Also do you happen to know if the charge times were increased for Levels 1 - 3?

Didn't see this till now. Sure charge times are double, but if applied right there should be plenty to do with the drops. 1-2 are not safe, but lower levels can be used in combos.

A good example is the HD combo on last thursday's blog post:
http://game.snkplaymore.co.jp/official/kof-xiii/blog/archives/2011/12/kof13.html (http://game.snkplaymore.co.jp/official/kof-xiii/blog/archives/2011/12/kof13.html)
The neat thing here is that they begin charging the DKs at the beginning of the combo which makes them perfectly useful.


Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: marchefelix on December 06, 2011, 04:51:27 AM
Here's something I've been wondering:

If you do a special move that requires  ;b or  ;d (in other words, Head Crusher, 'coz that's the only move he has that uses those buttons) and you hold that button, will it count as charging a Drop Kick?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: BioBooster on December 06, 2011, 05:21:19 AM
It should. Give it at try?
Title: Re: Raiden
Post by: tastylumpia on December 06, 2011, 06:52:13 AM
Even you're iffy on the long charge time, it may be a good idea to charge anyway when you're stuck in a long combo so that when you go back to neutral you shave a few seconds til lvl 3/4.