Dream Cancel Forum
King of Fighters XIII => Character Discussion => Mature => Topic started by: nilcam on July 27, 2010, 02:51:03 AM
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(http://i1005.photobucket.com/albums/af171/dreamcancel/kofxiii/mature.gif)
Notation
;a = Light Punch
;b = Light Kick
;c = Strong Punch
;d = Strong Kick
* = EX version possible
Special Moves
Despair - ;dp + ;a / ;c *
∟ Tsuika ;a / ;c
Metal Massacre - ;qcb + ;b / ;d *
Death Row - ;qcb + ;a / ;c (up to 3 times) *
Ebony Tears - ;qcf ;hcb + ;a / ;c *
Desperation Moves
Nocturnal Lights - ;qcf ;qcf + ;a / ;c *
Heaven's Gate - ;qcb ;hcf + ;b / ;d
Neomax
Awakening Blood - ;qcb ;hcf + ;a ;c
* = EX version possible
Mature's Wiki entry (http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=Mature_(XIII)).
Console changes:
* Ebony Tears comes out faster. Can hit opponent afterwards
* Weak Metal Massacre is a one hit attack
* EX Deathrow correctly puts crouching opponent into hitback state on a hit unlike arcade version. If the opponent is crouching during 1-4 hits, a fierce Metal Massacre can still combo with a drivecancel.
- EX Despair doesn’t move Mature behind the opponent even if they’re crouching
Producer Yamamoto says:
Ebony Tears is a lot easier to use now. Weak Metal Massacre has been changed to a single hit and does less scaling, so it might be useful for fast paced matches.
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Infinite Set-ups
No Drive
- dp+A~P, qcb+P xN
- dp+AC, qcb+P xN
- dp+AC, dp+AC, qcb+P xN
- JCD (CH), dp+A~P, qcb+P xN
50% Drive
- qcb+P (9), (DC) dp+P~P, qcb+P xN
- qcb+P (9), (DC) dp+AC, qcb+P xN
- qcb+P (9), (DC) qcb+BD, qcb+P xN
- qcb+P (9), (DC) qcb+BD, dp+AC, qcb+P xN
- qcb+P (9), (DC) qcf hcb+AC, dp+A~P, qcb+P xN
- dp+AC, qcb+B, (DC) dp+A~P, qcb+P xN
- dp+AC, qcb+B, (DC) dp+AC, qcb+P xN
- dp+AC, qcb+P (9), (DC) dp+A~P, qcb+P xN
- dp+AC, qcb+P (9), (DC) dp+AC, qcb+P xN
50% Drive/Air Variants
- dp+AC (AA hit), dp+AC, qcb+P (9), (DC) dp+P~P, qcb+P xN
- dp+AC (AA hit), dp+AC, qcb+B, (DC) dp+P~P, qcb+P xN
- dp+AC (AA hit), dp+AC, qcb+P (9), (DC) dp+AC, qcb+P xN
- dp+AC (AA hit), dp+AC, qcb+B, (DC) dp+AC, qcb+P xN
- JCD (CH), dp+A~P, qcb+B, (DC) dp+A~P, qcb+P xN
- JCD (CH), dp+A~P, qcb+B, (DC) dp+AC, qcb+P xN
- dp+C (Cross-up), qcb+B, (DC) dp+A~P, qcb+P xN
- dp+C (Cross-up), qcb+B, (DC) dp+AC, qcb+P xN
100% Drive
- qcb+P (9), (DC) dp+P~P, qcb+B, (DC) dp+P~P, qcb+P xN
- qcb+P (9), (DC) dp+P~P, qcb+P (9), (DC) dp+P~P, qcb+P xN
- qcb+P (9), (DC) dp+P~P, qcb+B, (DC) dp+AC, qcb+P xN
- qcb+P (9), (DC) dp+P~P, qcb+P (9), (DC) dp+AC, qcb+P xN
FUUUUU~
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I just read in another thread that Mature supposedly has an infinite. Is this true?
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I just read in another thread that Mature supposedly has an infinite. Is this true?
Yes
http://dreamcancel.com/forum/index.php?topic=73.msg231#new
some quick notes
- Despair has an EX
- Tsuika (the follow-up attack) does not
- the input for Ebony Tears is ;dn ;df ;fd ;df ;dn ;db ;bk+ ;a/ ;c*
- Her Neomax is done with both A and C together
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So, how solid is Mature in this game? Does she have anything else going for her outside of the infinite? Some of the players I've seen in videos seem to rely on that and play her somewhat gimmicky. I used to play her all the time in OG 98, so I'm looking forward to her in XIII. I'm just hoping that she doesn't get branded as a gimmick character.
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I did Heaven's Gate against Robert's fireball and went through it. It appears that it has invincibility much like XI Adelheid's LDM. I'll try to do some more testing on it this Thu.
Her d+B, like King, goes under Robert's fireball as well. Haven't tested it out against Andy or Takuma.
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So, how solid is Mature in this game? Does she have anything else going for her outside of the infinite? Some of the players I've seen in videos seem to rely on that and play her somewhat gimmicky. I used to play her all the time in OG 98, so I'm looking forward to her in XIII. I'm just hoping that she doesn't get branded as a gimmick character.
Because she has an infinite, players are playing in a way that will lead to the infinite.
If she didn't have it they would play in a different way, she looks solid to me, but then again so does everyone else.
Metal massacre seems like it's really good from what I saw in the sbo video, and she's an extremely fast runner :)
EX Ebony Tears seems extremely good, like Heidern's projectile except multiple hits, mixups anyone?
If she didn't have an infinite players would probably be exploring her "real" combos more, but since she does it's better to just find ways into that.
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Because she has an infinite, players are playing in a way that will lead to the infinite.
If she didn't have it they would play in a different way, she looks solid to me, but then again so does everyone else.
Metal massacre seems like it's really good from what I saw in the sbo video, and she's an extremely fast runner :)
EX Ebony Tears seems extremely good, like Heidern's projectile except multiple hits, mixups anyone?
If she didn't have an infinite players would probably be exploring her "real" combos more, but since she does it's better to just find ways into that.
Yeah, I figured as much. It's just a little annoying when you're trying to find out about a character and you just keep seeing the same combo/strategy in nearly every vid. It's like, yeah, I know she has an infinite, but what ELSE can she do? The other stuff you guys listed sounds pretty promising, and I like what I saw from her technical reference vid. I was very disappointed with the way she was handled in XII, so I'm just kind of anxious to see how she turns out in this game.
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Mature really looks fine even if she didn't have the infinite. But that's just me.
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Moved to the top, thanks Kane317
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Mature is a solid character even without the infinite.
But she is also the hardest character to link attacks, comboing cr. ;b cr ;a is such a pain now. It was way easier in XII.
Even her Death Row is strict on timing.
Mature is definitely not an easy to use character.
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Mature is a solid character even without the infinite.
But she is also the hardest character to link attacks, comboing cr. ;b cr ;a is such a pain now. It was way easier in XII.
Even her Death Row is strict on timing.
Mature is definitely not an easy to use character.
I'm going to have to disagree, links in general require more strict timing, but that is across the board. Mature is still relatively easy to use (even without the infinite) IMHO.
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Well the infinite has been removed with the 1.1 update, so how about some legit combos?
- j. D, st. C, qcb+Px3
- j. D, st. C, qcb+Px3, (DC) qcb hcf+K
- j. C, st. C, (BC) st. C, [qcb+Px3 (7)]x3, qcfx2+P, qcb hcf+AC
- cr. B, cr. A, qcb+Px3
- j.C, st. C, qcb+P, (DC) qcb+D, qcb hcf+K
- j.C, st. C, qcb+BD, st. C, qcfx2+P
- qcb+P (1), (DC) qcb+D, qcb+P, st. C
- st. C, qcb+BDx2, st. C, dp+A~P, st. C
- j. X, st. C, qcb+P (9), qcf hcb+AC, dp+A, qcb+Px3 (9), st. C
Technical Reference
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCabeLhO2_o
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Sorry for asking a noob question but what's the (9) indicate in this combo? hits? I'd love to try this out.
- j. X, st. C, qcb+P (9), qcf hcb+AC, dp+A, qcb+Px3 (9), st. C
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I believe that refers to the number of hits you get after doing qcb+P 3 times.
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I can´t wait to see some videos of Mature in actions, depending 100% on her skills, without any infinite bullshit.
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What exactly is the point of her EX Death Row besides her hitting five times instead?
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What exactly is the point of her EX Death Row besides her hitting five times instead?
It does a slight bit more damage, and it would also be more efficient in drive canceling compared to the regular version since each rep does one hit each instead of three so it doesn't push the opponent back as far
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Anyone else get tired of seeing Matures STILL do nothing but (EX) despair (DP+P)? Seriously...Compared to 98 and 02 it seems like people forgot how she plays (I mean she’s not a gimmicky character), you RARELY see anyone do her classic BnB combo (that she STILL has) cr.b>cr.a/cl.b > Death row or zone with her ebony tears. Typical matches you see with Mature players are just do random (EX) despair or jump CD.I understood when she had the infinite but come on.
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I wouldn't blame the players. Despair is really that good. I was quite surprised how much damage EX Despair does on a clean hit, not to mention being able to cross up on her C version.
But yeah. I haven't seen people use her old BnB combo and Ebony Tears pressure for a while. I get to see maybe once or twice but that's about it.
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I have a question. Can she still do 3 crouching light attacks into Nocturnal Lights? I can't even seem to get the 3rd hit in so I was wondering if it's not possible, would a standing A connect as a 3rd hit?
From what I've been playing, it seems she can still connect d B, B (I'm not sure if anyone mentioned it yet since I'm not familiar with terms like cl.) so if anyone has a hard time connecting Nocturnal Lights from crouching lights, this would make things much easier although you'll have to be pretty close to get that standing B off.
It seems I couldn't really do d B, B, d A on a blocking opponent to continue pressure so I'm assuming her d A doesn't have the same range as her 98/2002 version (which is probably why I can't fit in 3 lights into Nocturnal Lights).
Other than the things I mentioned, specials aside and a few changes to her normals, I felt she was her usual 98/2002 self. I played her that way the entire time and it still gave me success although I started messing around with some of her specials since it seems a lot of her specials have improved.
My post may sound odd but I never read up on XIII before playing so I played things just like it was 98/2002.
And I love her new jump CD. Although it works similiar to her old jump CD, it comes out much faster (although I believe it lacks range). I love to use it while jump backwards (it usually catches people trying to jump into me while I try to gain distance from them) preparing for Ebony Tears setups.
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I dunno how we missed your post Persona. I'll make sure I get the resident Mature user, 4leaf, to chime in.
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Some interesting combos with Mature (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NLZrbdF00_Y#t=2m35), especially after a qcb+BD into Far C setups.
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It looks more like Close C than Far C to me. It is quite interesting though.
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It looks more like Close C than Far C to me. It is quite interesting though.
We're both wrong, I looked again and it's a down C according to the Mook (http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=Mature_(XIII)).
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I think Close C and Down C works either way anyway? I should try this out when I have the chance.
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It looks more like Close C than Far C to me. It is quite interesting though.
We're both wrong, I looked again and it's a down C according to the Mook (http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=Mature_(XIII)).
Tested this, it's close C. Even all light attack didn't connect after qcb+BD for some reason, thought it was weird. It's more or less a 1 frame to link it, so it's definitely not easy to do.
j.C, s.C -> qcb+BD, s.C -> qcb+B does like 38% damage. Right now trying to get it consistent and add a super cancel on the end.
In the corner she can also do this:
j.C, d.B, s.B -> qcb+P x3 -> DC dp+A, A, qcb+B, s.C
A note on her qcb+P x3 -> DC dp+A, A - you need to cancel on the last high of the third qcb+P because it put the opponent in the air. If you do it before the last hit, they'll still be on the ground. You would only do this in her HD combo for her qcb+B -> HDC qcb+P x3 loop
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It looks more like Close C than Far C to me. It is quite interesting though.
We're both wrong, I looked again and it's a down C according to the Mook (http://dreamcancel.com/wiki/index.php?title=Mature_(XIII)).
Tested this, it's close C. Even all light attack didn't connect after qcb+BD for some reason, thought it was weird. It's more or less a 1 frame to link it, so it's definitely not easy to do.
j.C, s.C -> qcb+BD, s.C -> qcb+B does like 38% damage. Right now trying to get it consistent and add a super cancel on the end.
In the corner she can also do this:
j.C, d.B, s.B -> qcb+P x3 -> DC dp+A, A, qcb+B, s.C
A note on her qcb+P x3 -> DC dp+A, A - you need to cancel on the last high of the third qcb+P because it put the opponent in the air. If you do it before the last hit, they'll still be on the ground. You would only do this in her HD combo for her qcb+B -> HDC qcb+P x3 loop
Oops I forgot to update the post, I tested it and it s.C. I think told you and 4leaf in person.
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I was looking through some of the Revelations matches and noticed some impressive Mature play in this video. Not much match footage linked in this thread, so I thought it might be useful:
Mature vs Maxima/Vice/Kula (2 matches) (http://youtu.be/hjr_5FWHLLQ)
For the set-up after reset juggles with close C (where the player cancels into dp+C~C), can you control whether it crosses up? It looks like it should be able to hit on either side depending on how you time the dp+C~C attack, but it seemed to always switch sides in those matches (aside from near the end of match 1 round 2, but Vice was in the corner there, so it probably couldn't cross up). It'd be kind of lame if the other player could always block it in the same direction.
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That Mature player was 4leaf, and yes after dp+P you can choose when to do the follow by pressing P or if want you can not do the follow up at all. So yes it can be used as a cross up but depending on yourand your opponents position.
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First page has been updated with console changes.
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* Ebony Tears comes out faster. Can hit opponent afterwards
* Weak Metal Massacre is a one hit attack
* EX Deathrow correctly puts crouching opponent into hitback state on a hit unlike arcade version. If the opponent is crouching during 1-4 hits, a fierce Metal Massacre can still combo with a drivecancel.
- EX Despair doesn’t move Mature behind the opponent even if they’re crouching
Producer Yamamoto says:
Ebony Tears is a lot easier to use now. Weak Metal Massacre has been changed to a single hit and does less scaling, so it might be useful for fast paced matches.
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opponent can jump over her neomax if they're in the corner at the apex of the jump during neomax active frames. Would look funny in a match seeing as everyone will think it will connect/
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For a simple HD combo that I was trying to do with Mature, I've noticed a lot of notations will say QCB+P(7)x3 or something similar. But I can't seem to HD cancel the move into itself, which I'm sure I can't. I've noticed her QCB+K move looks like the third hit of the rekka, so if I do something like QCB+Px3 HC QCB+K repeat, am I doing it wrong all together and thus ruining my damage output? (I can record something quick if it helps to understand). If I remember correctly, doing that combo from j.C>C>etc into QCB,HCF+K to Neomax only got me slightly over 620 damage.
If anyone has better ideas for HD combos, I'd like to see them, honestly I'm bad at trying to pick up combos from videos (but I'll try nonetheless).
Since I've recently taken a liking to the character, I'd like to know of a good placement for her on my team as well. From my small experience she needs some meter but she also doesn't seem to thrive off of it either (meter helps everyone for sure, duh). The other characters I am using are Joe and King, and maybe I can use her on point, or maybe second?
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The only time a move will Drive/HD Cancel into itself is if the latter move is an EX move. Are you sure you were pushing both punches? As for damage output, I'm not really sure. The light version of qcb+K is often a better choice though since it hits once now (thus less susceptible to damage scaling).
Personally, I'd put her first or second in the team as she builds meter quickly while stocks give her a lot of options, especially her EX Despair.
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I'd say use Mature second, but it all boils down to how you play the character. If you are playing her as solely rushdown then put her on point. If you are using her pokes to find openings more often then put her second. Honestly she can be played either way.