Messages

1

Iori Yagami / Re: Iori Team Position

« on: August 04, 2016, 01:52:18 AM »

IMO Iori is as he ever was if this game is intended to be 'more like 98'. Doesn't matter where you put him, he can carry an entire team. This version probably isn't as good as Iori '98 (best Iori ever) but it comes damn close.

If you consider it from the standpoint of "Ok, I need a character that can get in whenever he wants, get out whenever he wants, and can play inside, outside, at all ranges" then Iori can do it all. He's not really limited to being useful 'only when he has meter' or 'only in EX' like say, Shun'ei.

You're going to see a lot of single Iori OCV comebacks if they don't nerf him in the future.

2

Kyo Kusanagi / Re: Kyo Breakdown

« on: August 04, 2016, 01:46:13 AM »

One small correction, EX qcf+P is the EX Dokugami, not Aragami. Aragami does not have an EX version.

EX properties:
-Full armor from start to until the hitbox comes out (someone do this against Maxima's FIRIN MAH LAZOR! sometime :D)
-1 full body step extra range, will cleanly combo from close C, f+B

EX Dokugami is most likely intended to be a very long range punish IF you're preempting something and you know the move will hit. First two hits of the chain can be used as hitconfirms... If it hits, do the FULL 4 hit chain.

3

Kyo Kusanagi / Re: Kyo Breakdown

« on: August 03, 2016, 02:23:34 PM »

Added the movenames for you here otherwise, sorry, its REALLY confusing to read... Kyo players generally will know his movenames. Also added the last 2 hits of the Dokugami chain which you didn't have, tho I don't have an analysis of these beyond 'horrendously unsafe, do not do unless hit confirmed' :P

You also didn't have the new followups for the Aragami, added those... Go ahead and analyse em.

Couple other things to add to your list:
-2nd hit of close C is not special cancellable but it is SUPER cancellable
-2nd hit of df+D is also SUPER cancellable
-Close standing B will link into Aragami (qcf+A), this is a HUGE deal as besides XIII EX Kyo, Kyo has never had this in the past. It was underused in XIII but it may be used more here, time will tell... especially if the Ya Sabi is safe on block.
-Crouching/close A will also link into Aragami
-EX Kototsuki (hcb+BD) now has a whiff, unlike XIII where it didn't

<movelist edit removed, no longer needed, see first post>

4

Kyo Kusanagi / Re: Kyo Combo's

« on: August 02, 2016, 11:50:36 AM »

2 meter anywhere, anchor: j.D cl.D df.D(2) MAX cr.C df.D(1) dpb+BD qcf+B~B qcf+BD SC qcfx2+P

577 dmg

What kinda damage values have y'all been getting for 2 meter combos? that's the biggest one I've come up with so far

That's more or less the best you're going to get. You may get more if you DON'T do any supercancelling and just charge the supers and release them as late as possible, going by the discoveries earlier in this thread. Standing C into f+B after the MAX activation may give like... 10 more or some pissant amount that really isn't worth debating :P

5

Kyo Kusanagi / Re: Kyo Combo's

« on: August 02, 2016, 04:25:22 AM »

idk man i think you can just roll :/

Step back outside of roll range. The move still has more than enough step in reach and speed to hit. This also makes it so that unless they have a super long fast poke, they can't hit you out of it either so their options are really limited.

Granted the invincibility on the move is nowhere NEAR what it was in KOF99. In KOF99 even if they jumped, you could wait for them to stick out an attack and blow right through the jump attack... But with the way XIV is I guess it'd be way too much to expect that level of hax.

6

Kyo Kusanagi / Re: Kyo Combo's

« on: August 01, 2016, 08:43:33 AM »

Only the 182 Shiki increases in damage.

In the lab right now. Orochinagi does 190 uncharged. Charge for one second, it does 210. Two seconds does 240. Max charge does 270.

Respectively, 182 shiki does 165 uncharged, 179 for one second, 222 at two, 241 Max.

EX Orochinagi, with the same charge times, does 313, 342, 370, and 399.

EX Shiki, 328, 356, 385, 423.

This can be useful; st. C xx df. X xx qcf D D > orochinagi does 272 is the orochinagi is done immediately. If charged a little, it can do 288.

Well, holy shit x.x

First KOF ever where Kyo's Orochinagi actually gains from a charge... This definitely solidifies my claim that 'less is more' then. If you were to simply perform the MAX Orochinagi after  upkicks and do nothing but charge... you're going to get a lot more mileage out of it than if you were to supercancel and let it go. The fact that the MAX Orochinagi is like its XIII self (1 frame execution on release) means you can really delay RIGHT to the last moment for the highest damage possible...

You're probably not going to see the MAX 182 Shiki used in the same way too much... well maybe, but this really does give a reason to play the 'unblockabait' game with the move. Lets say, score a hard knockdown in the corner via the Aragami -> Migiri Ugachi combo and then back off a step or two and just charge the move... By the time the opponent starts to get up, they don't really have many options. Most will be just holding block by pure habit and will eat the unblockable. I keep thinking back on that one filthy ass unblockabait super Orochi Yashiro had in 98 which literally executed right as an opponent rose from a hard knockdown... and it was unblockable at max. Wonder if this can be used in a similar way...

7

Kyo Kusanagi / Re: Kyo Combo's

« on: July 28, 2016, 01:30:02 PM »

Only the 182 Shiki increases in damage. Its also unblockable when fully charged and has some invincibility when Kyo is doing the body spin before the first elbow comes out. It can be used to blow through a few things.

The Orochinagi is as it always was, MAX ver hits 3 times.

8

Iori Yagami / Re: canceling rekka into super

« on: July 26, 2016, 01:38:07 AM »

I've been using a dualshock4 too due to stick not working... I have a feeling you just stated your problem: You're doing the super as fast as you can.

That's probably way too fast. When I do it, I have to let my hands IDLE for a sec in neutral and it feels like there's a lot of idle time. BUFFER the two Aoihana inputs, and then wait for the moves to execute, the moment you hear the first Aoihana hit, start the super motion.

At least that's how I do it, it feels like you have way too much time to do it. If you're feeling like you're forced to rush the input, then you're probably not buffering the Aoihana and actually doing each move unbuffered... It won't work like that.

9

Kyo Kusanagi / Re: Kyo Combo's

« on: July 25, 2016, 05:48:52 AM »

If you're going to MAX as a combo extender then you'll only get 2 EX moves. Its balanced this way to prevent too much BS. If you want the EX RED kick, then your followup will be EX upkicks and that's the end of your EX.

This KOF seems to use scaling via hitcount as well as damage, so with Kyo remember that he has a lot of 'small hits' that will very quickly kick in scaling on his bigger hits.

Rather than fuss too much with the  , the question you should be asking is: IS IT WORTH doing  ?

I've seriously found myself cutting back on the fancier crap simply because the damage gained from adding 5-6 hits is literally less than half a notch on the lifebar... It very quickly becomes not worth the work.

Combo wise for BnB super combos, I've been sticking to these:

  , ,  ... supercancel to  /
  ,  ,  ...  .. supercancel to whatever

The only time I'll use  is if you started your combo a bit further out than normal and you need the  to close a bit of distance, or if I'm using the move as a long hitconfirm to MAX from st ,  .

Otherwise either ppl are not aware that the Aragami now combos from lights like in XIII or they're just too deadset on using the  ,    ,  ...  / that we've seen in all early tournaments lately... Kyo really does have a SHITLOAD of options this time round. The last hit of the Aragami is also reasonably safe so now if your Aragami is blocked, do the entire chain! The MOVE itself has a lot of delay but the last hit has a ton of pushback as well, making it safe... if it WHIFFS it is horrendously unsafe so only do the entire Aragami string if its BLOCKED. The first Aragami itself is completely safe, its some BS like -1 on block. The 2nd hit of the Aragami is NOT safe under ANY circumstances and you should never end it with this, unlike KOF98... always now do the entire 3 hits.

  upkicks are safe no matter what... the speed and recovery of this move is almost bullshit tier. I've even used it as a wakeup punish...

10

Iori Yagami / Re: canceling rekka into super

« on: July 25, 2016, 05:23:23 AM »

Do it with the other button.

Ie if you're going  , then do the Ya Otome input with  and vice versa.

Also the timing is not strict, at all. What you want to do is do the rekka input, let the stick go to neutral for a split sec, THEN do the Ya Otome input. The timing is identical to KOF2k1, if you've played it.

Either the 1st or 2nd hit of the Aoihana can be supercancelled. Its recommended to do the supercancel off  if you can help it as opposed to the  version as the  version won't connect cleanly in the open, while  will.

11

Kyo Kusanagi / Re: Kyo Combo's

« on: July 22, 2016, 03:57:06 PM »

stC has 0 activation and hits instantly, also 2nd hit of stC can be cancelled into supers (not specials).

dnC has about... 4? or so frames of activation and can be beaten out by other stand C's that are instant.

12

Kyo Kusanagi / Re: Kyo Combo's

« on: July 22, 2016, 09:28:54 AM »

One thing I am waiting for someone to try out in real live match situations once the full game drops... Hell I may try this myself... is the fact that Kyo's qcf x2+P DM can be charged and is unblockable when fully charged.

Its already been tested/proven that the EX ver of this DM has KOF99 style invincibility during the release spin before the first elbow hits. If anyone remembers how KOF99 Kyo wound up playing, that DM was used raw, often, simply to blow through all sorts of moves. It also was a viable 'trap' after a hard knockdown as by the time the other guy was up and able to move, the DM was almost charged to max and most people on pure instinct alone will simply be blocking at that point... conveniently forgetting its unblockable when charged.

A climax cancel from that DM, raw, does around 80% damage if fully charged, no fancy combo needed... just EX DM into Climax DM. Simple, easy, and ridiculously painfully damaging. Seeing that KOF XIV is looking to be less combo oriented than XIII and these little traps and tricks are now viable again, this may be quite a powerful thing Kyo has going for him... Time will tell I guess.

13

Kyo Kusanagi / Re: Kyo Combo's

« on: July 22, 2016, 06:14:13 AM »

Remember 'less can be more' with Kyo. He suffers quite heavily from hit scaling in this game it seems so tacking 'more hits' can be counterproductive to big damage.

Variant of your combo, for the fun of it:

j d+C, sC, df+D 2hit.. MAX.. sC, f+B, rdp+BD.. qcf+BD.. qcf+B,B, hcb+B (1hit sc) qcf 2x+AC.. climaxcancel.

Slightly easier execution wise, and the EX RED kick grants you a ground bounce as well as 'perfect close' positioning due to its property to put Kyo right next to the opponent regardless of distance. It also has a fair bit of carry so can help with cornering. The HCB+B after the qcf+B,B is due to the lack of airtime from the qcf+B upkicks, the elbow effectively locks them perfectly almost at 'eye level' with Kyo, so that it doesn't matter which Max DM you choose to do it will fully connect.

What's sad: Just do run in close C, f+B, qcf+C, qcf x2+AC and climaxcancel when reasonably near the corner... The difference in damage vs the extra work required execution wise is not so much... :/

Less is more... Less is more...

14

Mai Shiranui / Re: Mai Shiranui

« on: July 21, 2016, 01:45:24 AM »

I dunno about the damage scaling on the target combo yet; it may deal less damage than C > MAX > C despite doing more hits. But I'll have to check later cause I'm at work right now.

She had a target combo like it in 13, but they've both nerfed and buffed it (net buff) for this version. It can no longer start from far B, so your hit-confirms can't be as long, but it's now special-cancellable no matter what.

cB,B,D if possible or simply B,D is definitely the opener of choice for MAX. Its just far easier and gives you a bit of breathing room. The other thing to check is does her close B hit low? Its been ages since I touched XIII and I can't remember, can't check now coz I'm at work.

The fact that the target combo is cancellable into anything now makes it useful. I for one do not understand Capcom's mindset where they give everyone a TC in SFV but over 70% of them cannot be used to combo... I just do not understand the logic...

15

Mai Shiranui / Re: Mai Shiranui

« on: July 20, 2016, 03:39:17 PM »

I disagree with this, actually. I tried Mai's Rush combo in the lab and unlike KoD's surprisingly good one (IDK why it's plus on block but KOD kinda needs whatever he can get), Mai's has nothing to really recommend for it. The 2nd and 3rd hits are both unsafe on block, and IMO the meterless route to low-height Musasabi no Mai isn't worth it. Remember that one of the goals of a hit-confirm is not just to give you time to recognize that you're hitting the opponent, but also to be safe on block. Mai's Rush Combo doesn't satisfy the 2nd condition because unless you have 0 meter for Musasabi no Mai, there's no way to be safe without stopping at close A (which you really should).

Also, no offense to the SNK devs (they really ARE doing a bang-up job with this game), but just because they INTEND for something to be used doesn't guarantee that it IS useful. Some Rush combos like KoD's are surprisingly useful, but I tested Mai's to look for hidden gold and I'm pretty sure there is none. You're much better off doing c.B > c.A > qcb+C, or even c.B > close B,D > hcf+D (target combo is unsafe, but you can stop at close B, which is safe and still cancellable).

If you want "quick and dirty" damage with Mai, all you really gotta do is stock 1 bar for MAX cancels. Mai's midscreen meterless combos are admittedly ho-hum, but she has much better corner options (s.CD wallstick, qcb+A resets). But a simple MAX-Cancel combo with Mai to qcb+AC > hcf+BD does tons of corner carry and very decent damage.

Fair enough, I did a bit more testing and yeah, the 3rd hit is unsafe. For a while I thought the amt of blockstun actually made it just safe enough but nope, I'm wrong here.

Shame tho, if it did just a bit more pushback it'd be safe enough to use, making it quite useful.

Also, I had NO IDEA she had that B,D target combo! Its not listed anywhere in the movelist that I can see. That target combo effectively gives her a command move that she lacks and is quite useful. Great find, it needs to be added to the movelist as it really can open up options. The immediate most obvious gain is it gives her a hitconfirm option into MAX mode, which is worth its weight in gold as doing B,D max, B,D is a LOT better than C, MAX, C.