Author Topic: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)  (Read 76471 times)

desmond_kof

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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #120 on: June 20, 2013, 04:13:06 PM »
Any thoughts on this video by Juicebox, Elisabeth players?
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Killey

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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #121 on: June 20, 2013, 10:30:24 PM »
It's a well done tutorial video for beginner-to-intermediate players as intended. I prefer his way of explaining the spacing after qcf+A and dp+A. Also, I've been trying to find a way to explain the different juggle properties off of dp+A and dp+C and I really like his way of calling it half and full juggles (not sure if this was used in previous KOF's).

The video mostly reinforces what Oscar and I talked about during the Elisabeth podcast. However, I think we were mistaken about the EX command dash being full body invincibility. Based on the video it looks like it's only upper body invincibility. He also did confirm that EX command has full body invincibility. I've actually corrected all of this in the wiki already. lol

There's only 2 things that I had issues in his video.

1) HD combos - He said the simplest 3 bar combos were cl s.C, f+B, HD activation, cl s.C, f+B xx dp+C, dp+A, qcfx2+P xx Neomax. The damage output was like 747 when he could have simplified it to cl s.C, f+B, HD, far s.C xx dp+C, qcfx2+p xx Neomax for 767 damage. Both are easy to do but from a beginner perspective, less inputs and more damage is better.

He also did 4 bar combos involving adding Grand Rafale after the Neomax when you might as well do EX qcfx2+P xx Neomax for like 891 damage.

2) Counter Hits - I would have liked to see him go into her counter hit scenarios more. I feel that this is really important in her game at an intermediate-to-expert level. I know his aim is for beginner-to-intermediate but the knowledge of what you get off of Counter Hit qcf+A, s.CD, and j.CD is really good info.


Also, check out http://www.twitch.tv/mexikof/b/361050950 for some high level Elisabeth play from Cebollas. It really outlines her strengths and weaknesses and the spacing you should be aiming with the character.

« Last Edit: June 20, 2013, 10:32:16 PM by Killey »

Killey

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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #122 on: July 28, 2013, 11:52:08 PM »
So I didn't notice that standing normals on counter hit vs an airborne opponent causes a half juggle state. This lets Elisabeth combo into QCF+A or DP+A and transition into fully combos from there. Very situational and hard to hit confirm during the neutral game; however, it's very applicable in the frame trap game or in her command grab mind games.

cydvis

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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #123 on: August 28, 2013, 04:16:32 PM »
A little option-select:
http://youtu.be/tLMaRrMR4bg

I didn't show it in the video but it beats throws, back rolls and some reversals
« Last Edit: August 28, 2013, 04:30:40 PM by cydvis »
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Killey

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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #124 on: August 28, 2013, 06:31:56 PM »
A little option-select:
http://youtu.be/tLMaRrMR4bg

I didn't show it in the video but it beats throws, back rolls and some reversals

Does this still work with the standard DP+C, DP+A, DP+A starter? I would assume it would but just double checking.

Usually forward rolls and reversals are the most common escape options for this reset. Usually with the DP+C, DP+A, DP+A, hyper hop j.A->cross up hop j.B reset it's a safe jump against 3 or 4 frame reversals and covers forward and back rolls. If the opponent back rolls they're back rolling close to you so you can punish with close s.C->f.B, etc... on recovery. If they forward roll you can catch them with a far s.C xx DP+C on recovery.

Prior to evo2k12 I was testing OSing specials in a similar fashion to SF4 and it does work but the timing is more strict. I think it might be possible to do something like this with qcf+BC but I'm not sure if this would cover against reversals unless maybe you delayed it.

cydvis

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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #125 on: August 28, 2013, 06:52:38 PM »
Does this still work with the standard DP+C, DP+A, DP+A starter? I would assume it would but just double checking.


I used the DP+A, DP+A starter because it's short (recording dummy time) and easy. I made the video to show that the  ;dn ;df ;fd ;b+ ;d;fd ;df ;dn ;db ;bk ;fd ;a can be turned into an  ;dn ;df ;fd ;a if the command dash crossdown the opponent at close range.
It was the first application i thought of it.
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mechanica

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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #126 on: September 01, 2013, 07:06:30 AM »
Is that hyperhop A followed by normal hop B? I could never get the spacing to get the crossup thing so this is cool.
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marchefelix

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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #127 on: September 01, 2013, 05:56:33 PM »
« Last Edit: September 05, 2013, 10:42:32 PM by marchefelix »

cydvis

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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #128 on: September 02, 2013, 03:33:13 PM »
Is that hyperhop A followed by normal hop B? I could never get the spacing to get the crossup thing so this is cool.

I use (and I think most of elisabeth players use the same)after DP+A, DP+A then:
 - hyper hop forward A, hop forward B/C/D/CD (crossup)
 - hyper hop forward A, slight pause, hop forward B (hits not crossup but elisabeth looks the wrong way)

The "not crossup" way is usually better I think

EDIT: one more thing not related (and useless most of the time), the input  ;fd ;dn ;df ;fd + ;a + ;c is an option-select for elisabeth. One side she does DP+AC, on the other side she does EX counter... maybe it can be usefull on some wake up situation... maybe :/
« Last Edit: September 02, 2013, 09:20:06 PM by cydvis »
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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #129 on: September 05, 2013, 09:44:51 AM »
Hey guys....im not an Elisabeth player, but im very interested in her. Ive got a few questions though.

1) Is she meter reliant? Or is she a solid character even without heavy meter use (I dont want to spend more than a bar or two with her). Does she build good meter?

2) What characters / matchups does she have a hard time with and why?

3) Is she really as execution intensive as Juicebox says in his Elisabeth primer?

4) What does she excel at ?


Thanks to anyone who is willing to answer the questions ! The reason im being so adamant about not spending a lot of meter with her is because Ive got Leona on anchor.....and Leona is non negotiable. If anything I can put Elisabeth on my secondary team though.

Killey

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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #130 on: September 05, 2013, 05:14:22 PM »
Hey guys....im not an Elisabeth player, but im very interested in her. Ive got a few questions though.

1) Is she meter reliant? Or is she a solid character even without heavy meter use (I dont want to spend more than a bar or two with her). Does she build good meter?

2) What characters / matchups does she have a hard time with and why?

3) Is she really as execution intensive as Juicebox says in his Elisabeth primer?

4) What does she excel at ?


Thanks to anyone who is willing to answer the questions ! The reason im being so adamant about not spending a lot of meter with her is because Ive got Leona on anchor.....and Leona is non negotiable. If anything I can put Elisabeth on my secondary team though.

1) She's reliant on meter for higher damage output and some defensive options.

2) Elisabeth has bad range on most of her normals so she tends to struggle vs characters who have better range on their normals (Karate, Kim, Clark, Hwa, etc...). It makes playing the neutral game really tough with her and she needs to win the neutral in order to apply offensive pressure. She's also weak to rush down because her defensive options are bad so once you find yourself in the corner you're going to have to block it out or spend meter on GC blowbacks/rolls or a risky reversal (EX Iori).

3) She's one of the more execution intensive characters only because her max damage combos require specific timing on her juggles. The actual motions for her attacks aren't difficult at all.

4) She has some good space control tools and a tricky mix up game that can disorient people who aren't familiar with the match up.

If you're new to KoF, Elisabeth will help you grasp the combo system of KoFXIII much faster than other characters. Otherwise, I generally don't recommend the character for beginners mostly because of her weaknesses.

cydvis

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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #131 on: September 05, 2013, 05:26:28 PM »
I'm certainly not an expert KoF player but...

1) She can do really good damage meterless BUT I think she need to have 1 meter (for the threat of  ex dash to ex command grab, for the ex counter, for the anywhere juggle super and for the guard break potential and defense)

2) I have a hard time against characters with good normals. She is lacking in that department... and she need meter to defend herself... and her reversals with meter are kinda bad.

3) I didn't try all the characters but she is a hard character execution wise. She needs precise timing and execution for most of her combos and juggles.

4) She have great mixups IF you manage to not screwing your combos AND land a hit/ex counter/ex command grab AND not screwing your post-combo setup (that's a lot of conditions).

She is the kind of character that can kill someone really fast if you guess right (and don't mess with your timings/inputs).


EDIT: I forgot to write about it and I don't know if it's in the wiki, there is a nice guard break combo for elisabeth:
jump CD, close C forward B xx command dash xx qcf A+C, close C forward B xx HD activation, close C forward B xx DP C (guardbreak) ... and continue with HD combo corner (without using meter after i can do about 550 damage)

Cost 100% drive and 1 meter, gives the opponent about 60% of power meter. There is a tiny hole after qcf A+C (the opponent can try to jump) but elisabeth is on frameadvantage after that move anyway.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2013, 08:54:15 PM by cydvis »
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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #132 on: September 06, 2013, 12:27:32 AM »
thanks for the quick and in depth responses guys, much appreciated

Killey

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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #133 on: September 06, 2013, 04:59:56 PM »
EDIT: I forgot to write about it and I don't know if it's in the wiki, there is a nice guard break combo for elisabeth:
jump CD, close C forward B xx command dash xx qcf A+C, close C forward B xx HD activation, close C forward B xx DP C (guardbreak) ... and continue with HD combo corner (without using meter after i can do about 550 damage)

Cost 100% drive and 1 meter, gives the opponent about 60% of power meter. There is a tiny hole after qcf A+C (the opponent can try to jump) but elisabeth is on frameadvantage after that move anyway.

Elisabeth is +12 after EX Etincelle (qcf+AC) so there's no gap between that and her close s.C. If you set the dummy to one guard jump and do EX Etincelle and an immediate close s.C after wards it's a true block string. It is a viable strategy to delay the close s.C after wards for a frame trap.

The only issue with the guard break string is it's really easy for the opponent to just guard cancel roll/blow back so you really have to keep an eye on their meter before hand.

Malik

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Re: Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)
« Reply #134 on: October 22, 2013, 04:18:54 AM »
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