Topic: The King of Fighters XIII Gameplay discussion (All shortcuts on 1st page)

[davidkong07]

hey guys, i have some technical questions about wakeups in KoF13.

in this game, there are obviously no "reversals" as in SF4, where a properly timed wake up move gets special properties. however, i was wondering about doing wakeup uppercuts on the first possible frame. i have experimented with mashing uppercut in training mode, and it seems that it is never instantaneous, that there are a couple frames where i simply stand and can get hit before the uppercut comes out. why does this happen? is it possible to do special moves on the first frame of wakeup, or does the engine make you wait a couple frames? i know that, for example, there are a few frames which take place before you can be thrown on wakeup. is there something similar for special moves?


i'm wondering because, if this is the case, the implication would be that a properly timed meaty attack on an untechable wakeup should always beat out mashed uppercut, right?

[MUSOLINI]

fuck no, 1 frame EX supers, command and super grabs, EX dp's, superfast dp's with tons of invincible frames. depending on the character your facing this could be the most retarded thing you could. a meaty would be fine on lets sayking without any super bars.

[Saitsuofleaves]

Yeah, reversals exist in almost all if not all FGs with special moves and waking up.

SF4 just gave a special property to theirs that just tied into a unique aspect of the SF4 series itself.

[MUSOLINI]

sf4 gameplay system is pretty much fucking retarded. they went soo noobish on the system that they made it a boring shit fighter where sf2 tactics that where bs and old school worked again, and made easier. i understand noobs liking it, what i never understood is why the pros got into super noob fighter 4 turtle edition unless your using 1 of the 4 or 5 non turtle characters. it's a very decent but shitty fighter, especially on higher level.

just some of the problems, shitty match ups, the fact that FA can absorb an attack, the whole ultra system, the turtle like slow ass gamespeed, the fact that most of the game revolves around wait and see, how easy it is to tech throws, i could go on basically.

[Siren]

a wakeup dp has enough priority in that game to ignore parry supers like cammy's cqc. I don't think any game loves dp's more than sf4. and the reason so many people got into to it is because it's street fighter, there's ryu and capcom on the label. As shitty as the games gonna be, sfxt is going to be popular because it's from crapcom and has ryu. People just play shitty capcom games, it's sad but true.

[Saitsuofleaves]

Seriously, we gonna fill up the thread with this shit again?  We have a place for that crap in the Social Club.

Only reason I even BROUGHT UP SF4 was because he was wondering about the reversal system in comparison.  That wasn't an invitation to drop the usual shit on Capcom.  That attitude is WHY Capcom does so well.  You do more shittalking on them then you do praising the games you actually light, which keeps the spotlight on their games.  Wanna make sure they go down?  STOP TALKING ABOUT THEM.

Anyway, on topic, yes reversals exist, don't try to meaty when the opponent has meter or you die.

[omegaryuji]

i'm wondering because, if this is the case, the implication would be that a properly timed meaty attack on an untechable wakeup should always beat out mashed uppercut, right?

XIII has wakeup reversals, just like every KOF.  It's just a really tight window to input it correctly (possibly...this tutorial by PhoeniX does into more detail about reversals in KOF).  Whether a properly timed meaty will beat out a wakeup reversal depends on the reversal's properties, namely does it have enough invincibility through the entire startup and into at least 1 active frame to dodge the meaty (or does it have instant autoguard to absorb the meaty hit immediately) and does it have a hitbox that will work effectively against the meaty (i.e. in past KOFs, it's common to use a cr.B meaty against Kyo since it lets many characters low profile under the knockdown hit of his dp+C so that Kyo is still punishable).

[MaruchanSoup]

As shitty as the games gonna be, sfxt is going to be popular because it's from crapcom and has ryu. People just play shitty capcom games, it's sad but true.

Wow, you and me have a lot more in common than just the avatar picture.

Anyway, on topic, yes reversals exist, don't try to meaty when the opponent has meter or you die.

What is a good thing to do when the opponent has meter and is waking up?
Should i attempt an ambigious roll crossup or even that is too risky?

[Saitsuofleaves]

Depends on the opponent's character and positioning, depends on your character and positioning, a lot of things go into it.  Better to look at case by case examples rather than trying to generalize what to do on wakeup.

[omegaryuji]

Should i attempt an ambigious roll crossup or even that is too risky?

Like Saitsuofleaves said, there's no general rule for what to do (you should be mixing up a few different things, in any case), but there is a general rule for what not to do: if your opponent has a 0-startup throw, don't be standing right next to them unless you want to eat it.

[Siren]

I wouldn't try it often, but I'm not sure if this game auto corrects notations, but an ambiguous roll crossup could probably throw throw them off and keep them honest and blocking(or they get hit). But you could always go for safe dp baits and punish if they actually dp. Just try out your options and see what works best. I'm sure someone else can come up with better advice than mine lol.

BTW kewl pic MaruchanSoup lol.


@SaitsuoFleaves
I wasn't planning on going on a rant there, but my bad. I actually hate when threads get off topic like that also myself.

[giga_d]

Ambiguous rolls are ok but ambiguous crossups are also and option. With Kensou you can do a crossup attempt and just spam down b's either way and see if they connect to hit confirm something from them.

Seriously, we gonna fill up the thread with this shit again?  We have a place for that crap in the Social Club.

Only reason I even BROUGHT UP SF4 was because he was wondering about the reversal system in comparison.  That wasn't an invitation to drop the usual shit on Capcom.  That attitude is WHY Capcom does so well.  You do more shittalking on them then you do praising the games you actually light, which keeps the spotlight on their games.  Wanna make sure they go down?  STOP TALKING ABOUT THEM.

pretty much, I have a zero tolerance on anything Capcom, except the usual peek at what the latest fad talk the UMVC3 crazies are going nuts about elsewhere. I guess I shouldn't be one to talk but I view the umvc3 stuff because the ppl are just so brainwashed it's funny.

[Saitsuofleaves]

Then keep that shit to yourself or take it somewhere else.  I don't give a shit WHAT your tolerance is, if you honestly care about THIS game, then you should know better.  You don't think I have a problem with Capcom at times?  You don't think I like bashing on some of their products?  Of course I do, but there's a time and a place for it.  When a thread for another game is filled with more talk about Capcom than the actual game, then you're only helping them.

As for the topic, roll crossups work somewhat but I would use that sparingly.

[darkTown2]

Ambiguous rolls are ok but ambiguous crossups are also and option. With Kensou you can do a crossup attempt and just spam down b's either way and see if they connect to hit confirm something from them.

Seriously, we gonna fill up the thread with this shit again?  We have a place for that crap in the Social Club.

Only reason I even BROUGHT UP SF4 was because he was wondering about the reversal system in comparison.  That wasn't an invitation to drop the usual shit on Capcom.  That attitude is WHY Capcom does so well.  You do more shittalking on them then you do praising the games you actually light, which keeps the spotlight on their games.  Wanna make sure they go down?  STOP TALKING ABOUT THEM.

pretty much, I have a zero tolerance on anything Capcom, except the usual peek at what the latest fad talk the UMVC3 crazies are going nuts about elsewhere. I guess I shouldn't be one to talk but I view the umvc3 stuff because the ppl are just so brainwashed it's funny.

i don't understand how a person can judge someone else's game just because it isn't their game of choice... why can't you just look at something that isn't your favorite, see it for what it is and move on? that attitude would make the fighting game community a much better place.

[Saitsuofleaves]

Yeah, I mean, personally, there's a decent amount of games I don't like, but I at least respect the people that play them and let them do what they want to do.