Tier lists and Character Discussion Thread

[Nagato1992]

The post on hwa is not bad by nagato... But you missed out all his normals... He has one of the best s.D or s.A or s.C+D or j.C+D... And slide... Also you can't just block against a good Hwa or he'll tick throw you (alternate guard won't work)... All the characters you mentioned that can zone him, he can just hyper hop their FBs... Also if you eat any of his DPs while drunk, you will loose at least 500+ anywhere on screen with 1 drive...

s. from Hwa is his best move.  I play Hwa as well, but like I said, if he gets an offense going he can really wreck your shit.  That is why his only flaw is close range defense and getting drunk.  As for the zoners, you are right to an extend.  If Hwa goes against a mix character who has great zoning abilities and great offense, that is when he has trouble.  Andy is very strong against Hwa because he can safejump him, has a DP for those hyperhop attempts over fireballs.  He can super the hops as well since Chou Reppadan has invul. startup.  Andy just has to watch for slide beating Zaneikan and pressure Hwa as much as possible.  I play both characters and I have played the Andy(me in his shoes)/Hwa match up quite a lot.  I had trouble with Hwa at first then I realized that Hwa cannot punish Andy from a safejump setup(like grab, zaneikan, normal jump D) when usually its not a safejump.  Hwa Jai's AA DKick is 8 frames startup so you can easily safejump it with a lot of people.  Hwa is just like any other character with amazing offense.  Characters like him lack true offensive options so they can get blown up relatively fast if you rush them down and put your knee into their gut.  He has one of the top offenses in the game, but if you use everything the game gives to you in terms of mechanics and your character, you will come out topping Hwa.  I'd say he is A+ ONLY if drunk, but without it he is A- at best.  He is very good, but he is NOT S.  A perfect example is Raph vs Reynald at FinalRound.  You can say it was because of Benimaru, but overall Hwa's defense is not that good.  You can easily bait out his backbreaker.
KOF13 Top 16 AS Reynald vs OAR Ralph - FR XV - Road to Evo 2012

[Tikok]

I also think that Hwa is very overrated because of his damage when drunk and while he's a good character, he's definitely not as good as someone like EX Iori.

[LouisCipher]

Disagree. Drunk Hwa is just amazingly good. If you make one mistake with him and he has at least 1 drive and 1-2 bars that's going to be at least 700-800 damage. EX Iori just doesn't have that, he's still amazingly good though.

[Running Wild]

And get grabbed for 340 damage? I think people are underestimating him quite a bit. There is more to Hwa Jai then spamming qcb+D

It's called fuzzy guard, it's been in KOF since forever.

[Matt Alder]

Hwa's slide is never negative on block unless you do it without cancelling into it. s.B, s.A or whatever cancelled into slide will leave you at least a +0, if not better. And I also wouldn't say that crouch-blocking Hwa is a great plan, as his hyperhop D WILL cross you up, leading to midscreen crossup pressure strings. His light normals also hit crouchers and give him massive advantage on block, giving him amazing pressure and grab setups.

[NissanZaxima]

Everyones thoughts on Ralf? I dont see him very often at all and I have just recently picked him up. I sort of need a Benimaru break (I use Beni point) and Ralf seems like a decent point character. I see weaknesses and can kind of tell he will have some bad matchups.... but he definitely has some godlike buttons and nasty frame trap game. I dont think he is necasarily tops or high but he really seems like a pretty competitive character even though not too many people use him.

[bopper]

And get grabbed for 340 damage? I think people are underestimating him quite a bit. There is more to Hwa Jai then spamming qcb+D

It's called fuzzy guard, it's been in KOF since forever.

You cant fuzzy guard forever. With that mentality, all commandgrabs would be usless in this game, wich is defenitly not the case. And alternative guard opens you up to low hits aswell. Hwa Jais big weakness is his really bad/floaty jump, but his superb ground game and absurd damage of random hits makes up for it big time.

[Frofighter]

Everyones thoughts on Ralf? I dont see him very often at all and I have just recently picked him up. I sort of need a Benimaru break (I use Beni point) and Ralf seems like a decent point character. I see weaknesses and can kind of tell he will have some bad matchups.... but he definitely has some godlike buttons and nasty frame trap game. I dont think he is necasarily tops or high but he really seems like a pretty competitive character even though not too many people use him.

You hit the basics of him right there. He's got great normals, tight frame pressure, and solid damage. His issues come against strong zoning and when he's on the defensive. He has no legit answer to zoning, he isn't good at covering his head or going air-to-air if the opponent is outside his jump CD range. He also doesn't have reliable reversals. I've seen him played around the board, but he seems to be favored on point where the opponent doesn't have as much meter to use against him. I'm not that knowledgeable about him, but there's what I know in a general sense.

[Blake/White]

K' is not the best point on the game but he is one of the best.  He goes at 1st or 2nd really well and he still blows up a good bit of the cast. 

Not quite what I was getting at, I'm not saying he's not a good point, I just don't think the point position is best for him. He really does do a lot better in this game when he has some extra meter hanging around for EX Trigger.

[Kane317]

Hwa's slide is never negative on block unless you do it without cancelling into it. s.B, s.A or whatever cancelled into slide will leave you at least a +0, if not better.

That's not true, s.A into slide is at least -1 coz you can get 1F command grabbed. 

[t3h mAsTarOth...!]

He meant s.A, s.A, s.A, d/f+B

[venusandeve]

I thought frame counts weren't cumulative???

[Tikok]

They aren't. That blockstring creates space between the opponent and Hwa Jai , so that his slide hits on the last active frames, giving him more advantage on block.

[Kane317]

He meant s.A, s.A, s.A, d/f+B

Ah I see.  I read it "either s.A or s.B into df B". 

[LouisCipher]

Kim, Shen, and Mr. Karate are considered high-tier characters here. Cafe:Id members just don’t play Mr.Karate because they think he’s not fun to play. Cafe:Id members usually choose fun characters to play, not strong characters. Guts and Verna also chose EX-Iori because he’s fun to play. In this case, EX-Iori is strong as well. KoFXIII is really well balanced. If you put your time and effort into any characters, they can be strong, except Robert and Athena (they just suck…).

In your face Satsuo. In your face!