The King of Fighters 2002/Neowave/UM/Tougeki General Discussion Thread

[omegaryuji]

Which BC combo of clark?

The one I usually see is cl.C(2), BC run, cl.C(2), grab (S)DM.  Definitely does more damage than it sounds like it should *laughs*

Yea you're right, i forgot to mention it, on PS2 you can, on Arcade you can't....

Assuming the tourney is played on PS2, would it be legal?

I haven't played in any official tournaments for 2002, but I don't see why it would be banned.  They're different characters, so why not?  I mean, you can pick a team full of Kyos.

[Dark Geese]

In regards to Mary- She is very solid, has good Level 1 maxmode combo options, good Max Mode CD Counter options, and she does pretty good damage. I will be playing with Mary myself more than likely in the next batch of Geese Tower matches in about 2 weeks...

About Clark: Its one in the Master Class video but I've known about it because I've seen it in Mexico- St.CxxActivate to his back, Forward+P special then canceling it into his grab super, that in itself really does some good damage. It roughly can do about 60% + damage alone by itself.

El Rosa: EX characters are completely legal in tournaments...Now FYI, with you going at EVO just know the only people that probably will even play 2002 UM with be the Japanese (DUNE), the Europeans, and maybe a few of the SoCal players and some others...

But I don't think picking both EX and regular Kensou is possible, but then again I could be missing one of those same character codes that allows you to do this, but as far as in a tournament match you really can't pick them (The game won't let you).

[jinxhand]

El Rosa: Now FYI, with you going at EVO just know the only people that probably will even play 2002 UM with be the Japanese (DUNE), the Europeans, and maybe a few of the SoCal players and some others...

Let's hope that this changes when XIII drops... There'll be no more exuses at that point...

Speaking of which, I would like to see 2002UM redone with XIII sprites... It's still a solid game, although I wish more was done to the engine other than changing stages and tweaking characters' moves/properties...

Glad to see Kyo-1 get raised a bit... What specifically made him get higher??? I know he's got some good BC combos that do some good damage (and some are fun to execute imo), but I wonder if it was more than just those combos that made him place higher... I thought everyone chose Kyo-2 and Kusanagi over him anyway. I'm like the only Kyo-1 advocate it seems... /sigh

[Dark Geese]

El Rosa: Now FYI, with you going at EVO just know the only people that probably will even play 2002 UM with be the Japanese (DUNE), the Europeans, and maybe a few of the SoCal players and some others...

Let's hope that this changes when XIII drops... There'll be no more exuses at that point...

Speaking of which, I would like to see 2002UM redone with XIII sprites... It's still a solid game, although I wish more was done to the engine other than changing stages and tweaking characters' moves/properties...

Glad to see Kyo-1 get raised a bit... What specifically made him get higher??? I know he's got some good BC combos that do some good damage (and some are fun to execute imo), but I wonder if it was more than just those combos that made him place higher... I thought everyone chose Kyo-2 and Kusanagi over him anyway. I'm like the only Kyo-1 advocate it seems... /sigh

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5P6D14gJI8

Remember the stream you were watching with me and Desmond? Let me link it and that way you'll see it for those people that wondered..he has some more stuff with BC/Manual Activation Level-1 that is effective if people use it and people forget though he doesn't have a DP he can use dp+k as an effective antiair.

Kyo-1 takes work, but if people are willing to be patient he can do a good amount of damage for just manual activation...

Plus I'll have to go through some JuareZ WarField 2010 footage where Kane9999 is playing with Kyo-1 (since he uses him)... and some JuareZ WarZone footage with the Chihuas guys playing him (Tarahumara) want me to post them???


Also something else I didn't get to land on Desmond I had ready lol was this combo right here:

1. Manual Activate, qcb+p, qcf+k,k MAX2... OTG fireball/punch...

This midscreen combo does hella good damage! The MAX2 must be timed correctly however..

[jinxhand]

El Rosa: Now FYI, with you going at EVO just know the only people that probably will even play 2002 UM with be the Japanese (DUNE), the Europeans, and maybe a few of the SoCal players and some others...

Let's hope that this changes when XIII drops... There'll be no more exuses at that point...

Speaking of which, I would like to see 2002UM redone with XIII sprites... It's still a solid game, although I wish more was done to the engine other than changing stages and tweaking characters' moves/properties...

Glad to see Kyo-1 get raised a bit... What specifically made him get higher??? I know he's got some good BC combos that do some good damage (and some are fun to execute imo), but I wonder if it was more than just those combos that made him place higher... I thought everyone chose Kyo-2 and Kusanagi over him anyway. I'm like the only Kyo-1 advocate it seems... /sigh

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5P6D14gJI8

Remember the stream you were watching with me and Desmond? Let me link it and that way you'll see it for those people that wondered..he has some more stuff with BC/Manual Activation Level-1 that is effective if people use it and people forget though he doesn't have a DP he can use dp+k as an effective antiair.

Kyo-1 takes work, but if people are willing to be patient he can do a good amount of damage for just manual activation...

Plus I'll have to go through some JuareZ WarField 2010 footage where Kane9999 is playing with Kyo-1 (since he uses him)... and some JuareZ WarZone footage with the Chihuas guys playing him (Tarahumara) want me to post them???


Also something else I didn't get to land on Desmond I had ready lol was this combo right here:

1. Manual Activate, qcb+k, qcf+k,k MAX2... OTG fireball/punch...

This midscreen combo does hella good damage! The MAX2 must be timed correctly however..

The video is private, I tried logging in and still wasn't able to view it...

Well, I know about being a good AA move, but I'm not sure if anything can connect from it (I'll test that out today)... When I do play him, I try to use this punish combo, which works both offline and online, and isn't as hard as it seems:

cl.C~(BC), df+C xx qcf qcf+A/C

It does a good amount of damage, and in the corner, you should be able to follow up with the same SDM. I'm not even gonna front though, I can't remember if it can be followed up or not that way in the corner, but I believe the followup connects...

cr.C also serves as a good AA if the opponent is closer. This can and at times should be canceled to qcf+a/c to keep the opponent from making a quick return on rushdown... This can also allow Kyo-1 to do his thing in terms of rushing, although limited...

Anyway, Kyo-1 is so underrated imo... He's like Lee Pai Long in NGBC in that sense...

[Dark Geese]

Okay I'll ask Desmond if he can release the live feed video so that people can see it from the video of me and him playing it...since I do quite a bit of stuff with Kyo-1 in that actual stream set of matches..

EDIT: He said he'll make it not private so I'll let you know when you can watch it..

[desmond_kof]

The link should be good now fellas. I forgot to set it back after I uploaded it because I found out that the sound de-syncs after awhile and I was trying to fix it.

[omegaryuji]

So, out of curiosity (and since this thread is supposed to over both versions of 2002), anyone have a tier list for OG 2002?  This is the one in the wiki:

God tier (ABC): Choi, Athena, Billy

High Tier: Leona, Yuri, Iori, Benimaru, Vanessa, Angel

Mid Tier: Everybody else

Bottom Tier: Seth, Chin

At a glance, it seems to underrate Angel, May Lee, Whip, and Kim, but my knowledge/experience is pretty limited, so I'm curious what some better players think.

[jinxhand]

So, out of curiosity (and since this thread is supposed to over both versions of 2002), anyone have a tier list for OG 2002?  This is the one in the wiki:

God tier (ABC): Choi, Athena, Billy

High Tier: Leona, Yuri, Iori, Benimaru, Vanessa, Angel

Mid Tier: Everybody else

Bottom Tier: Seth, Chin

At a glance, it seems to underrate Angel, May Lee, Whip, and Kim, but my knowledge/experience is pretty limited, so I'm curious what some better players think.

I'm no uber strong player, but I feel Kim definitely deserves a spot for upper mid, or at least low to low/mid high tier (?). His damage and mixups alone grant him high mid. Plus he has range for a non-projectile and non-weapon based character.

I'm thinking that the "everybody else" is kinda there because outside of one obvious reason (lengthy list o' characters), this section I'm pretty sure seems to fluxuate from time to time. I believe a few of those characters have gone up and down several times just in that section, not based on region, but just within the fighting system/engine itself and what the character is capable of doing vs "x" character.

[omegaryuji]

I'm no uber strong player, but I feel Kim definitely deserves a spot for upper mid, or at least low to low/mid high tier (?). His damage and mixups alone grant him high mid. Plus he has range for a non-projectile and non-weapon based character.

I'm thinking that the "everybody else" is kinda there because outside of one obvious reason (lengthy list o' characters), this section I'm pretty sure seems to fluxuate from time to time. I believe a few of those characters have gone up and down several times just in that section, not based on region, but just within the fighting system/engine itself and what the character is capable of doing vs "x" character.

Tier lists within tier lists *laughs* .

But yeah, I know most of the cast in fairly balanced and can't really be put into tiers (or at least the differences tiers will be small enough that it's worth the trouble).  Was mostly just curious which characters other people thought were strong/weak enough to separate from the pack.  As much as tier lists are pretty meaningless by themselves, the discussion behind coming up with them is usually interesting, at least to me.

As far as my opinons go, like I'd said, I think Whip and Kim are strong enough to be worth putting above "everyone else" tier, and I think Angel and May Lee are strong enough for top tier.  The Shermies are probably bad enough to put down with Seth and Chin, too.  Robert and Ryo could probably be argued for a upper-mid tier.

[AzureTAG]

The OG 2002 tier list on SRK wiki look more like a Mexico tier list.

God Tier: Angel, May Lee, Athena Asamiya, Billy Kane

High Tier: Choi, Kim, Whip, Clark, Vanessa, Benimaru, Iori, Kula Diamond, Yuri

High-Mid Tier: Leona, Chris, Yamazaki, O. Yashiro, Mai, Daimon, Yashiro, Andy, Maxima, Kusanagi, O. Chris

Mid Tier: Terry Bogard, Ryo, Joe, Takuma, Ramon, Shermie, Ralf, Robert, Kyo, Mature, K'

Low-Mid Tier: Mary, Chang, Vice, Kensou, Seth, O. Shermie

Bottom Tier: Chin

This seem accurate....okay maybe Vice should be at LEAST "Mid Tier" and (If order within tiers matter) K' look like he should be between Takuma and Ramon. Kula and Leona should switch places...
Edit: K9999 is missing..

[marchefelix]

A question not related to gameplay:

After I beat the 1P mode, there's a sequence of win poses for all the characters when the credits roll. In it, there's a win pose by Yamazaki when he goes bat shit insane. I've seen that win pose in '98 but never in this game. Are there specific requirements to get this win pose?

I hope someone knows what I'm talking about because I can't find a video to show you what I mean.

[omegaryuji]

I think you're talking about the pose he goes into during the first part of his qcf+ABCD DM, in which case...yeah, it's only used for that DM, as far as I can tell.

[SAB-CA]

Just droppin' a note to say GG's to N4US ^_^ Chronicle our first time playing aganist each other in 2K2UM XBLA somewhere Connection felt pretty good, since we're on opposite ends of the US, especially!

[jinxhand]

Just droppin' a note to say GG's to N4US ^_^ Chronicle our first time playing aganist each other in 2K2UM XBLA somewhere Connection felt pretty good, since we're on opposite ends of the US, especially!

Yeah I definitely have to admit that the netcode got better for 02UM... I've been playing a gangload of people from all over the states, and it's been great!!! I got caught is some BC combos, too...