Elisabeth Branctorche (Console)

[Sharnt]

And while I'm here, might as well ask. What's her best options to apply safe pressure? I'm having trouble keeping the offense going and getting dp'd a lot which is making me hesitant to attack in a lot of cases. I'm a KOF newbie if you couldn't tell

They do random dp to affraid you to do your pressing.
But what's a dp ? 120 to 200 dmg. If you bait one you can easily do more than 600 with a few gauge so just take a few to encourage them, bait one, kill their char after that and they will likely let you press more easily.

[Killey]

I discovered an option select technique before Evo but I didn't get to fully flesh it out to see how useful it would be.

I'll post it up here and see what other people can do with it but I'm sure the technique can be applied to all characters.

I got annoyed with people rolling away from cross up set ups so I wondered if I could OS it. I figured out that if you time a late jump-in and then buffer in a special move (in this case Elisabeth's command grab) and then p-link the attacking button with the button to initiate the command grab you could OS it.

For example, you do a hop 632146+B~C. If the opponent blocks or gets hit the command grab won't come out and you'll be able to apply pressure or combo from it. If they roll they get command grabbed. If they do a reversal and it wasn't safe jump timing you're going to get hit.

The timing on this is incredibly tricky and basically you need practice in training mode. If you do the whole thing without attacking your opponent then the sequence should look like j.B whiff land command grab. If you test the timing again against an opponent then the command grab shouldn't come out when j.B is blocked/connects.

In this particular scenario if you fuck up the p-link you're going to get HD activation, which is extremely bad and makes this OS method risky. I haven't played around with it too much because I couldn't make it consistent for me prior to Evo.

You can OS jump-ins on Oki with Etincelle's because I know people love holding up back in the corner on wake up and an OS C Etincelle will catch them.

[Fadedsun]

I just me or does this combo not work from the wiki?

c.B, c.A xx dp+A, dp+A, j.C

The j.C does not connect, and doesn't connect in either of the other combos at the beginning of the wiki. You can only connect a J.C after the first dp+A and not the second one. Am I missing something? I've tried it many many times now. Actually, it doesn't seem like you can connect a j.C after a dp+A at all.

Another thing I'm having trouble with is doing a drive cancel after a dp+A. Close s.C, f+B xx dp+C, dp+A, [DC], qcf+AC, qcf+C, qcf+C, dp+A, j.C

When I want to DC after the dp+A I always get a cancel into super because I'm buffering the motion when I do the DP.

[Saitsuofleaves]

You are missing something.  It's possible to land the j.C.

[SPLIPH]

i just picked up liz a lil while ago myself, and im pretty stumped about the j.C stuff as well. pretty much from any DP i have no idea how to get it to connect. ive just been doing hyper hop j.D instead. is there any benefit doing j.C instead of j.D?

for the dp+A [DC] qcf+AC; just do dp+A~AC. immediately press AC after the dp+A, no directional inputs needed. idk for sure, but you might have to do 6236+A (f,qcf+A) for the DC to work. i think somebody that knows more could answer better. my stick has such a tiny throw i cant get a dp to come out any other way.

i also have a question about this drive cancel when outside the corner. s.C, f+B > dp+C, dp+A, [DC] qcf+AC, qcf+B, qcf+C, dp+A > j.D

when i cancel the dp+A into qcf+AC outside the corner, sometimes it cancels into dp+AC instead. for this combo, qcf+AC only seems to come out when i buffer the DP input super early with a big gap before pressing A~AC. is that the only way for the cancel to come out, or is there a certain input i can add between the A~AC to keep dp+AC from coming out? i feel like im not doing that big gap between the input and button press for the corner combo, so i have no idea why the dp+AC is coming out outside of the corner.

[Fadedsun]

You are missing something.  It's possible to land the j.C.

Is there a video I can watch showing this combo? The j.C always whiffs. It's literally going right through them if I try to do it after I hit the second dp.A and go for j.C.

[Saitsuofleaves]

The thing is that DP+A has a limited juggle window.  After the second DP+A you have to leave the ground immediately and j.C at the apex of your jump.

[Killey]

I just me or does this combo not work from the wiki?

c.B, c.A xx dp+A, dp+A, j.C

The j.C does not connect, and doesn't connect in either of the other combos at the beginning of the wiki. You can only connect a J.C after the first dp+A and not the second one. Am I missing something? I've tried it many many times now. Actually, it doesn't seem like you can connect a j.C after a dp+A at all.

Another thing I'm having trouble with is doing a drive cancel after a dp+A. Close s.C, f+B xx dp+C, dp+A, [DC], qcf+AC, qcf+C, qcf+C, dp+A, j.C

When I want to DC after the dp+A I always get a cancel into super because I'm buffering the motion when I do the DP.

You're doing the j.C too late because landing the j.C is always possible. After the DP+A try holding up+forward on the joystick and press C as soon as you see her jump. If it's still whiffing then you'll have to press C earlier and then adjust the timing from there.

A little bit further in the wiki I wrote execution tips on her combos. Instead of doing the full qcf motion for the qcf+AC you roll the stick to forward or up+forward and press AC.

ive just been doing hyper hop j.D instead. is there any benefit doing j.C instead of j.D?

j.C deals more damage then j.D and it has a higher vertical hitbox as well.

i also have a question about this drive cancel when outside the corner. s.C, f+B > dp+C, dp+A, [DC] qcf+AC, qcf+B, qcf+C, dp+A > j.D

when i cancel the dp+A into qcf+AC outside the corner, sometimes it cancels into dp+AC instead. for this combo, qcf+AC only seems to come out when i buffer the DP input super early with a big gap before pressing A~AC. is that the only way for the cancel to come out, or is there a certain input i can add between the A~AC to keep dp+AC from coming out? i feel like im not doing that big gap between the input and button press for the corner combo, so i have no idea why the dp+AC is coming out outside of the corner.

Roll the stick to up+forward after the DP. So it'll be 623+A~9+AC and you should avoid getting a EX DP from coming out.

[NeoTrinity]

So I've been playing Betty since January and all this time I rarely use her extended, non-metered HD combos.  Generally when I'm in a position to do it, I just do her regular DC combos that can net me about 550+ damage anyway.  The only time I really hit the HD is when I can do something simple and kill or when I have 4 meters and if I get a clean hit Neo Max from EX DM and watch damn near 900+ health dissapear.

So my question is:  Is doing HD loops with her necessary?  It's kind of a pain to keep the Dp. xx Qcf. loop consistent, atleast for me, because of the timing and the possibility of getting her DM.  One corner HD loop I am practicing,however, is the Dp. -> Qcf. -> Dp. xx Qcb. xx Qcf. -> Qcf. -> Dp. xx Qcb. xx Qcf. -> Qcf. , etc.  But that's only because it looks cool to see her swag back and forth mid combo.  Kinda hard too, once again atleast to me, because you have to hit that Dp. just right or else the Qcf. 's wont juggle properly.

[SPLIPH]

elisabeths low cost HD combos are too weak. it is not worth it unless you use 3+ stocks for max cancel. a lot of times just going straight into EX DM > max cancel is enough to kill, but if you do 3 loops its aruond 993 dmg if you need the extra. it helps a 3 stock max cancel do solid enough damage. its a lot of work compared to the extra damage it gives, but its great to have it down.  i think the full screen loop is too hard to do in matches. props to anyone that has it down perfect. =p

i dont see any reason to do the qcb.D though other than for flash. does it help time the dp.A juggle?

[Killey]

Learning the advance HD combo goes back to risk vs reward. It's difficult to land it in the heat of the moment because you need to hit that DP+A at the lowest height to hit the qcf+C perfectly but if you can get the full loop into Neomax it's near a 100% dmg combo. She does have 100% combos but it requires landing a j.C and getting far s.C in the HD activation which isn't easy or having 5 meters to blow. That being said you just need 4 bars to do 893dmg with a simple s.C, f+B, HD, s.C xx DP+C, EX Super xx Neomax.

Using qcf/qcb+K can help with the timing of the qcf+C juggles since you don't need to hit the DP+A at the lowest height.

[Sharnt]

I reread the whole thread and nowhere I found a mention of the omgwtfbbq safe jump liz has after her command throw?

hcb f => hop hop.D
It safe jump else 3f moves (Shen CABC etc)
[KOF XIII] Elisabeth Mistral Safe Jump

[choysauce]

came up with some CH CD combos with Liz (sorry if these may have been mentioned) (also i think all the wiki's should include CH CD combos).

corner CH st.CD > qcf+A > dp+A > (DC) qcf+AC > qcf+Cx2 > dp+Ax2 > j.C

corner CH j.CD > qcf+C > dp+A > (DC) qcf+AC > qcf+Cx2 > dp+Ax2 > j.C

the first one is relatively safe on block, nigh impossible to punish.

[Killey]

I forgot to mention this here but I added some corner CH combos to the wiki.

I need to make an update and add some s.CD CH combos. You can actually do s.CD CH xx qcf+k (hit confirm), qcf+C, etc...

Also, I think I stumbled upon a really good safe jump OS setup.

Corner Drive Cancel BnB I listed in the wiki but instead of ending it in jump C, you do hyper hop j.A, land, hyper hop delayed j.B, then delay back s.C.

I don't think the safe jump will work against Kim or anyone who has a super fast reversal but I tested it against typical EX/DP's like Kyo, Andy, Mr.Karate, etc... and here's the results I get.

Unless the DP has a fast start up they get hit by a meaty j.B, giving enough time to combo into that delayed back s.C. If the DP is fast enough to come out you'll be able to block it unless it's specific characters like Kim. If they try to roll out the delayed back s.C will throw them out. I haven't tested this on all characters but thought it was worth noting for other people to dive into. 

[Killey]

Did further testing with the above safe jump setup and it's actually a 4 frame safe jump. Kim's EX Flash Kick beats it and some instant counter specials/neo maxes will beat it. Basically, any reversal that's 3 frames or less will beat it.

I've found several new combos for Elisabeth (posted in the wiki) that make her threatening even when she doesn't have drive. Basically, there's a few good ways to combo into EX Mistral from hit confirms, which let you combo into EX Etincelles allowing you to go to town with juggles. You should be able to score around 500 damage with 2 meters, no drive and end in a reset. Applying the same theory to her drive cancel combos also pushes the damage into the same resets.

I also posted the Sharnt's safe jump setup and video in the wiki and I've credited him for it.