Author Topic: Scene Building  (Read 4608 times)

solidshark

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Scene Building
« on: January 14, 2011, 07:53:48 PM »
With a new year, new fighters releasing, and XIII eventually coming this year, there may be more attempts at building a fighting scene. With a lot of success and failures I've heard and experienced, I've got a few tips and suggestions to make.

1) GO WHERE THE FIGHTERS ARE. This one I shouldn't have to mention, but I've seen people put up flyers for things and expect 5 to 10 people to show up automatically; not the case. If you've got ranbats in your area for other fighters, spread your message there.

2) BE WILLING TO PLAY WHAT OTHERS ARE PLAYING. I know there's an issue with this depending on what game they're playing (SSF4 for instance), but unless you're 100% dead-set against ever touching a controller or stick when a certain game is on the screen, give it a try. Doesn't matter if you suck or don't like it, you're showing others you can be open to certain things, which is important since you're soon to aske the same of them.


3) REALIZE IT WON'T HAPPEN OVERNIGHT. It won't. It just won't. If it does happen to you, congratulations you lucky bastard. For the rest, just keep putting the stuff out there. You might get more interest from passerbys than people knowing exactly what you've got planned.

4) BRING MORE THAN ONE FIGHTER. Versatility is key for many ranbats. If you're planning one, or attending one, don't plan on just playing one game. Most of the time you'll see ranbats with SSF4, BB, Tekken, instead of just one of them. Bring a few SNK games if you can, and not just KOFs. Garou, Last Blade, SS; even these games can appeal to those playing today's popluar stuff.

5) BE AWARE OF STIGMAS AND NICHE THINGS. SNK has a stigma in America, and probably many other places worldwide. Fighters are still niche, no matter how much SF4 (and maybe MVC3) have revived the fighting game community. They've revived interested in those games but not others. In a sense, you are trying to appeal to a smaller group than hype would suggest you are. Whether or not it grows beyond that is up to supporters/promoters like yourself. And getting into arguments with people on why one game is good or bad may come natural, but might not help what you're trying to do. Don't state a games goodness/badness like it's fact. You'd be surprised how "I like this game because..." gets your point across much easier, and gets people to consider what they might like about it once they play it.

6) DON'T BE AFRAID TO TEACH AS MUCH AS YOU PLAY. You should know what this is like if you're the only person in your area that plays SNK fighters. Don't get frustrated; show new players the basics, the need-to-knows. Relate them to other fighters (Ryo & Robert like Ryu & Ken, Vanessa similar to Dudley; I know these are stretched and broad generalizations, but how else is a new guy to relate?). If all fails, show them something flashy, SNK fighters have that in spades. Any of this will give you better competition, something every fighting fan loves.

7) NETWORK; MAKE CONNECTIONS. Keep communication up with other fighters if you can. As it goes, you can hear about a ranbat, attend one, attend another you heard about from the first, attend a tournament. Eventually, you might be asked by some to bring your SNK stuff and even hold your own tournament. (Worked for Nilcam, I believe).

8) MENTION DREAMCANCEL.COM/THE WIKI/OTHER RESOURCES. A big reason why some fighters that are great get overlooked is people don't know where to find out how to play. Just by mentioning this site, you can tell them about how there's a SNK community with lots of tips, links to vids, and even the most comprehensive Wiki for SNK fighting strategies that's growing as we speak. If they seem to be only into visual stuff, memorize some YT users with lots of XIII vids and mention them (like the AI streams, DesmondDELGHATTO, GAMEacho, kusanagistyle, etc.)


This is what I've got so far. If I think of anything else, I'll update.

Anyone with comments, disagreements, questions, or other suggestions, feel free.
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nilcam

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Re: Scene Building
« Reply #1 on: January 14, 2011, 09:19:44 PM »
This is the second time we tackle this important subject. Let's keep it on-topic and constructive so that this discussion can continue in a mature manner.

solidshark

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Re: Scene Building
« Reply #2 on: January 18, 2011, 08:03:47 PM »
Forgot to mention earlier, if anyone's got some successful accounts of running ranbats, tournaments, please mention them here. I'm currently strategizing how to improve the ranbats in my area.
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Re: Scene Building
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2011, 11:52:50 PM »
I know posting up flyers, and putting the tourney info on sites like Facebook, and even Myspace helps out for those people in your particular area... Giving the tourney a specific date down the road so that word of mouth can get around helps... I know when me and my homeboys in Hawaii would hold Tekken sessions at Tilt or at The Zone (internet cafe), we'd post up on TekkenZaibatsu, and let people know about it in other areas. We had 2 Tilts, a Family Arcade, and a Hawaiian Brians Billiard, which accommodated heavily to the arcade scene and everyone on TZ went to these different venues to battle... We even got some Capcom players to try out Tekken, and they liked it, until 5.1 came out :(

In those sessions at The Zone, I'd bring all kinds of fighting games, and my silver import ps2... One session would start from 1 or 2pm and didn't end til midnight, sometimes 2 or 3am...

krazykone123

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Re: Scene Building
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2011, 01:13:25 AM »
IMO I never had any interest in building a KOF scene in my area, sure I got my small group of friends that play KOF occasionally but they still suck and the actual Pittsburgh fighting game scene is already hella small (albeit dedicated). Until the usual casuals show some serious interest of wanting to improve I won't even bother trying to build a scene for KOF or any SNK game for that matter, what's the point in building a scene for a game half the dudes (or you) don't even take seriously right? I'd rather stick to training mode.

As for the topic at hand, lemme say one thing "Do not (I repeat) Do not attempt to build a scene for a game you yourself aren't going to play seriously." I constantly hear people wanting to build a scene for KOF which is nice and all but the main issue is "Are you any good at the game yourself?", Are you at least at the point where you play KOF on GGPO and try to get better? We got people like Desmond (MN), Syxx (IL), and Dandy J (OH) doing shit loads of work over in the Mid-West but the main thing they have in common is that they played the game first, some better than others. So if you want to do the same for your scene you should step back and ask yourself first "Am I going to take this game seriously?" or "Am I satisfied enough with my skill level that I can start teaching people (i.e friends) how to play?" if you meet those requires then you can go from there, if not then I advise you to quit while you're ahead.

1) GO WHERE THE FIGHTERS ARE. This one I shouldn't have to mention, but I've seen people put up flyers for things and expect 5 to 10 people to show up automatically; not the case. If you've got ranbats in your area for other fighters, spread your message there.

Agreed.

Quote
2) BE WILLING TO PLAY WHAT OTHERS ARE PLAYING. I know there's an issue with this depending on what game they're playing (SSF4 for instance), but unless you're 100% dead-set against ever touching a controller or stick when a certain game is on the screen, give it a try. Doesn't matter if you suck or don't like it, you're showing others you can be open to certain things, which is important since you're soon to aske the same of them.

Well you shouldn't have to force yourself to play a game you don't personally like, tolerance is a pretty over-rated concept especially amongst all these new players running around.

Quote
3) REALIZE IT WON'T HAPPEN OVERNIGHT. It won't. It just won't. If it does happen to you, congratulations you lucky bastard. For the rest, just keep putting the stuff out there. You might get more interest from passerbys than people knowing exactly what you've got planned.

True, but because of that, if you're not determined you might as well quit from the jump.

Quote
4) BRING MORE THAN ONE FIGHTER. Versatility is key for many ranbats. If you're planning one, or attending one, don't plan on just playing one game. Most of the time you'll see ranbats with SSF4, BB, Tekken, instead of just one of them. Bring a few SNK games if you can, and not just KOFs. Garou, Last Blade, SS; even these games can appeal to those playing today's popluar stuff.


Dedication to your own game should be enough but bringing other games for random casuals can be fun. Shouldn't expect too much but it's still a push in the right direction.

Quote
5) BE AWARE OF STIGMAS AND NICHE THINGS. SNK has a stigma in America, and probably many other places worldwide. Fighters are still niche, no matter how much SF4 (and maybe MVC3) have revived the fighting game community. They've revived interested in those games but not others. In a sense, you are trying to appeal to a smaller group than hype would suggest you are. Whether or not it grows beyond that is up to supporters/promoters like yourself. And getting into arguments with people on why one game is good or bad may come natural, but might not help what you're trying to do. Don't state a games goodness/badness like it's fact. You'd be surprised how "I like this game because..." gets your point across much easier, and gets people to consider what they might like about it once they play it.

There's many reasons for that stigma but I'd rather not get into that right now, besides that I agree I guess.

Quote
6) DON'T BE AFRAID TO TEACH AS MUCH AS YOU PLAY. You should know what this is like if you're the only person in your area that plays SNK fighters. Don't get frustrated; show new players the basics, the need-to-knows. Relate them to other fighters (Ryo & Robert like Ryu & Ken, Vanessa similar to Dudley; I know these are stretched and broad generalizations, but how else is a new guy to relate?). If all fails, show them something flashy, SNK fighters have that in spades. Any of this will give you better competition, something every fighting fan loves.

Sure I guess, providing your own examples tend to work just as well.

Quote
7) NETWORK; MAKE CONNECTIONS. Keep communication up with other fighters if you can. As it goes, you can hear about a ranbat, attend one, attend another you heard about from the first, attend a tournament. Eventually, you might be asked by some to bring your SNK stuff and even hold your own tournament. (Worked for Nilcam, I believe).

Definitely.

Quote
8) MENTION DREAMCANCEL.COM/THE WIKI/OTHER RESOURCES. A big reason why some fighters that are great get overlooked is people don't know where to find out how to play. Just by mentioning this site, you can tell them about how there's a SNK community with lots of tips, links to vids, and even the most comprehensive Wiki for SNK fighting strategies that's growing as we speak. If they seem to be only into visual stuff, memorize some YT users with lots of XIII vids and mention them (like the AI streams, DesmondDELGHATTO, GAMEacho, kusanagistyle, etc.)

Well there's a bunch of places they could go to learn KOF, besides if you want them to play it's YOUR job to teach them first, then you can send them elsewhere.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2011, 04:01:15 AM by krazykone123 »

desmond_kof

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Re: Scene Building
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2011, 03:23:40 AM »
I agree with Krazy, play, study and train hard in the game first before you start trying post up any fliers or run any tournaments. If you don't take the game seriously, others will feed from that and not take it seriously either.

But if you do have a lot of passion, dedication and interest in the game, that will inspire people to want to learn and look up to you for advice.

One example is Guilty Gear XX Accent Core. Up here in MN, we had a pretty small group of players but not real skilled. The guy the highest amount of understanding for the game wasn't the most social and actually turned some potential students of the game away. A very good player that was from New Jersey, then settled in Illnios a bit came up to work in Rochester, Minnesota which is an hour away from the Minneapolis/Saint Paul area where a lot of the players resided. He was so interested and committed to the game (and very good) that actually made a few of us very inspired and try to learn the game ourselves. He even coached me a bit and always shared tips, strats, and videos to me to improve. I'm still not as great as many players are in GG here in the Midwest by far, but he showed me a lot of what was in the game and helped me understand it more.

So, that's what you gotta do in whatever game you're willing to build a scene for. Take the game seriously, play it, then you will slowly but surely find others that are serious too that can either help you out or want to learn.
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Dark Geese

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Re: Scene Building
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2011, 04:29:25 PM »
1.  Until the usual casuals show some serious interest of wanting to improve I won't even bother trying to build a scene for KOF or any SNK game for that matter, what's the point in building a scene for a game half the dudes (or you) don't even take seriously right? I'd rather stick to training mode.


Well there's a bunch of places they could go to learn KOF, besides if you want them to play it's YOUR job to teach them first, then you can send them elsewhere.



See my entire situation for the most part in the USA. What you explain in the Pittsburgh area is what I have been experiencing on a national level over the past 5-6 years. Now you see the frustrations I have to deal with, if they aren't progressing I shouldn't have to keep flying having tournaments all over the nation. As you say until the people show interest/improvement, it isn't worth bothering. I'd rather instead of hopping on a flight somewhere in the USA, hop on one to El Paso and just cross the border.

Same thing on a nationwide level, until the skill level overall goes up DRAMATICALLY, or until people at least start doing things like Desmond, Syxx, AI are doing, again it isn't worth me traveling trying to do this stuff on a nationwide level.

I also side with it's hard to teach someone how to play a game if you yourself do not know how to play it!

I also agree I do not have to play a game I do not like. I may try it just to show people I can play it, but I am not going to play it forever if it is not my thing. Sure I understand be willing to play what others want to play if you want them to play what you want to play.

But I am past that stage, wayyyyyyyyy past that stage, that was about 6 years ago, I'm at a different point right now, and that's basically:

If you don't wanna play it fine. I'd rather find people that will play it seriously (If thats 40 here and 100 in Mexico) than 10 that will play it half-heartedly wasting my time being dabblers.

Goes back to what krazykone was saying!!!
« Last Edit: January 21, 2011, 04:35:42 PM by Dark Geese »

Lygophilia

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Re: Scene Building
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2011, 11:39:46 PM »
The choice is up to them, really. I have tried something like this before, arcades in East New Orleans and Metaire Louisiana. I currently live in Northwest Houston, which is rare to see others bother with king of fighters over here at Greenspoint. There real interest is toward Marvel vs Capcom and Tekken.

The lack of people to play whether they are serious or not, usually don't hinder me from trying to learn how to play fighting games by myself.. I admit that I wasn't into King of Fighters nor Samurai Shodown much for years, but I made the choice to, not too long ago.

« Last Edit: January 22, 2011, 12:02:28 AM by Lygophilia »

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Re: Scene Building
« Reply #8 on: January 22, 2011, 01:35:24 PM »
I'm so intrested building scene here. Population in my town is 3828 and most of the people are in for PC gaming (me too, but my other love is fighters). And last time they played fighting games were during PlayStation era (Tekken... And that is maybe the only franchise that they might regonize or Smash Bros. Brawl).

I have played few games with my friends (SVC Chaos, KOF XI, KOF 2002, KOF 98UM) They've liked them a bit, but they find SNK games too complex or get angry to me if I tell how to improve themselves. I'm very sure that I'm the only person around here who has copies of SNK games here on PS2 (and arcades only exist in big cities and I have never seen fighter cabinet there). So the only place to play games that match my taste of fighters is in my house.

Kinda hopeless, but I won't give up! Maybe I start building more serious scene when I move to bigger city after studies.

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solidshark

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Re: Scene Building
« Reply #9 on: January 22, 2011, 07:28:00 PM »
I'm so intrested building scene here. Population in my town is 3828 and most of the people are in for PC gaming (me too, but my other love is fighters). And last time they played fighting games were during PlayStation era (Tekken... And that is maybe the only franchise that they might regonize or Smash Bros. Brawl).

I have played few games with my friends (SVC Chaos, KOF XI, KOF 2002, KOF 98UM) They've liked them a bit, but they find SNK games too complex or get angry to me if I tell how to improve themselves. I'm very sure that I'm the only person around here who has copies of SNK games here on PS2 (and arcades only exist in big cities and I have never seen fighter cabinet there). So the only place to play games that match my taste of fighters is in my house.

Kinda hopeless, but I won't give up! Maybe I start building more serious scene when I move to bigger city after studies.



Definitely have been in your situation. If you still bring those games around to the other gamers, (someone else mentioned this, but I forget who) instead of trying to teach them, let some of the people play themselves, bring up the movelists if you think they won't be annoyed by that. Maybe even suggest a tournament to them, and emphasis on SUGGEST. If there's healthy competition between the players in terms of skill level in whatever they play, there's more of a reason to expose themselves in the fighters you bring. If you do that though, just stick with one game; makes it so much easier.

If you move to a bigger city later on, try to locate and hit-up their scene as early as possible with some kind of introduction.

The fact that you won't give up is probably your best asset to. As long as you're not trying to ram it down people's throats, and you show by-example how great the game is to play, you'll eventually catch someone's attention.
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Ash2k4

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Re: Scene Building
« Reply #10 on: January 23, 2011, 03:29:39 AM »
We use to have a scene down for kof svc, garou all snk where did it go you asked it died out once the arcade was closed . We had the regular ever week we have weekly torney. Than it shut down we use to go others people  house to others to play we even had three guys from mexico that how much the scene was alive here,  hell l remember staying up all night playing nothing but kof. But once the arcade died it pretty much killed the scene . As much as l would like to create a scene down its not going to happen all they play down here is super gay fighter 4 >.>
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solidshark

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Re: Scene Building
« Reply #11 on: January 23, 2011, 07:17:56 AM »
We use to have a scene down for kof svc, garou all snk where did it go you asked it died out once the arcade was closed . We had the regular ever week we have weekly torney. Than it shut down we use to go others people  house to others to play we even had three guys from mexico that how much the scene was alive here,  hell l remember staying up all night playing nothing but kof. But once the arcade died it pretty much killed the scene . As much as l would like to create a scene down its not going to happen all they play down here is super gay fighter 4 >.>

Might be worth giving it a try, if you've got home ports on SNK fighters. You'll never know till you try; you can make a good guess and the first results, but you'll never know until you try. And try, try again if the first time doesn't succeed.
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Re: Scene Building
« Reply #12 on: January 23, 2011, 09:07:37 AM »
I personally feel that there are more people that might be truly willing to play the game if they see more people playing it... As of now, when I get on Xbox Live or hit up Comic Odyssey and check out the sessions, its "the game that everyone plays", whether they like it or not, that's being played... I'm hoping to open their minds soon, since I know the owner well, and he's interested in learning KoF, and there are a few other "closet KoFers" that go there and play SF... But in any event, when some cats on xbl see someone playing a particular fighting game, they might get the inclination to get off of whatever fighting game they're playing and hop on that game that "x" is playing...

There's a few cats out there that make up excuses about why they don't play or why they can't... I know this cat on the VF forums, and he plays FFXI with me online... Anyway, he hit me up talking about how he placed 13th in a SFIV tourney down in Texas recently (supposedly it was a huge tourney), and I'm like congrats... So we talk about it, and it the convo goes to KoF because we were talking about how Abel is a KoF clone (based on moves and playstyle) and that convo went into a Joe discussion because we both play Joe (I know I topic hop alot)...

Anyway, I'm like "Yo, lets get up on some KoF, because I have yet to see how dope his Joe was... So he starts saying some mess about "I use my VF yomi to do well in SF4"... That crap makes no sense, because yomi is yomi regardless of the game you're playing, and plus last I checked, VF didn't have ;dp moves on wakeup (Kage's ;dp doesn't work like that either)... Anyway, we're still talking and he's like "I devote all my time and effort into VF. It's my blah blah blah." I'm like "Ok, well that doesn't mean jack since you devoted enough time to place 13th in a tourney... Then I guess in his final attempt to avert the convo, he starts talking smack saying "step your game up in VF." I'm like "man I can still crush in VF, and I haven't been playing in months (because I've been devoting a gangload of time in 98UM, 2k2UM, MoTW, and NGBC hardcore), and I proved to him I still had it (10-5 and he's pretty good too)...

Well, that right there is a big example of a cat that "plays KoF" but doesn't really "play KoF" and was making up excuses as to why he wasn't playing it... I would've been cool if he was like, "nah maybe another time" or something like it, but I still would've been hitting him up eventually... If you're gonna make up excuses, that mess isn't cool at all... And the whole elitist mindset was shutdown by the fact that another fighter was being played over one that he views as "the greatest"... Iunno, maybe I'm crazy...


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Re: Scene Building
« Reply #13 on: January 24, 2011, 03:25:57 AM »
Many people in the Maryland area only play that game that brings in the money and that game, at the moment, is Super Street fighter 4. I rather not build scene at Xanadu Games because for:

1. Many people don't even show up for SSF4 tournaments or Xanbats. Now if SSF4 ain't getting serious play, no way will KOF get better results.
2. Excuses. That's self explanatory.

I've gone Xanadu Games Xanbats many times and played KOF 2002UM by myself for 4-6 hours. On some nights, a few people would glance a the screen. On other nights, 1-2 maxed would try to play the game and show little interest. Most night though, it just me. Recently, the only good things about going to Xanadu is to take up their electricity and to play against Steve H.

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Re: Scene Building
« Reply #14 on: January 24, 2011, 10:19:28 PM »
Well you shouldn't have to force yourself to play a game you don't personally like, tolerance is a pretty over-rated concept especially amongst all these new players running around.


Tolerance is a pretty overrated concept period IMO...