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Messages - Kane317

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2776
Offline Matchmaking / Re: SoCal KoF
« on: August 18, 2010, 12:00:21 AM »
I was gonna recommend someone Spanish accent but since Oscar's willing to do the commentary, Antonio will sit this one out.

HAHA, shame only Ash and I would get this inside joke.

I vote that we need a feminine's touch so naturally RJ Steph Bao needs to help out =).

Fixed. I get to make fun of him 'cause he's my best friend, ahha. :3 And yeah, I'd totally trade realIDs with you, except I don't play SC2! ...:/ but I am a former WoW player :[ Whenever this ranbat is set for, I'll be very likely attending to watch haha :D

Just join anyways, we're not likely going to have an entrance fee for the tourney (if there is one), and ranbats are free.  It'll be fun.  OT: It just dawned on me how this thread really is AI KOF vs SoCal but I digress...

2777
Offline Matchmaking / Re: SoCal KoF
« on: August 17, 2010, 11:15:29 PM »
@Kane: :3 GG <3 Even with my trashy playstyle right now, haha. Also, what's your real name? I like to make a good habit of knowing people's real names too <3

Yuhang Ng.  There's it out in the universe now, we're going to exchange Real IDs as well...(bad SC2 joke).

UPDATE: Tentatively it's set for a Ranbat, but if the the show up is too high, we might just do a mini-tourney with one round elimination out of respect for Scott's time (Direct Feed).   Lol, there will be commentaries so don't hesitate to help contribute otherwise Oscar and I will be stuck hearing each other for hours.

I vote that we need a feminine's touch so naturally RJ Steph needs to help out =).

2778
Wouldn't it be a good idea to actually start a new thread on roll canceling?
Seems like something kind of important/specific to the KOFXIII engine.
We need to separated the general discussion and the technical discussion IMO.

Done.

Take all systems, technical, or gameplay discussions here.

2779
If you would like to add something to this section, please post in this thread.


Shortcuts/Sequential Buffering:

I'll post all the ones I know from previous KOFs as well, they should all work but if they don't please correct me.

-All qcf~hcb motions --> qcf x2~back + button
-Similarly, qcb~hcf --> qcb x2~f
-qcb~hcf --> qcb~db~f
-qcf~hcb --> qcf~df~b
-dp --> hcb~f

-Dash hcb x2 command throws (e.g Clark's DM)--> (somewhat close) hcb~f x2~hcb + button

-Canceling qcf into qcf x2 (e.g Shen's qcf+P, [DC] qcf x2+P) --> qcf + button, qcf+ button
-Canceling qcf into qcf~hcb (e.g Liz's qcf+P, [DC] qcf~hcb+P) --> qcf + button, hcb + button
-Canceling dp into qcf~hcb (e.g Robert's dp+P, [DC] qcf~hcb+P DM) --> dp + button, hcb + button
-Canceling c.d~u into c.b~f (e.g Leona's c.d~u+P, [DC] c.b~f+K) --> c.db/d~ub + button, [DC] uf (or f)+ button
-Canceling dp into qcf inside HD mode only (e.g Kyo's dp+P [1hit], [DC] qcf+P...) --> dp+P~P (Liz seems to be the only character that can do this outside of HD)
-Canceling dp into qcf (e.g K' dp+P, [DC] qcf+P)--> hcb~f+P, qcf+P
-Canceling dp into dp (e.g Yuri's dp+A, [DC] dp+K)--> dp+P, K: As long as the first motion is the same as the second motion and there's not too much lapse in between, you can just press the button again.


-Tricky motions like Shen's CABC can be hard to buffer.  You can start buffering it while getting up, in the air, during the ending frames of a move or even off a s.C itself.  A useful trick is to tap in this order (just hold the down motion the whole time): d.A, d.C, d.A, d.B (this will buffer the first 3 inputs) and press C when you want to activate the DM.  By doing this technique, Shen appears to only do two d.As (since neither d.C or d.B link off of d.As), as soon as the opponent jumps, press C.
-Beni's qcf+K --> d~u+K--> qcf~uf+K, K: As long as there's no delay it'll stay buffered.  Alternatively you can do qcf+K, f, uf, u+K.
-Billy's qcb A, into rapid A (cancel startup frames) into qcb C-->qcb A, C x4

HD bypass activation and tips

Bypassing the frames of activating Hyperdrive (BC).  Although it seems much quicker than previous incarnations, pressing BC during a heated battle is ill-advised as you're vulnerable to eating a fat combo. Instead, clever techniques have been discovered over the years to eliminate those frames such as--
 ∟Kim or Ryo's overhead, press BC on point of contact, continue combo while opponent is in hitstun.
 ∟Activating as a special like Kensou who can do, d.B, d.B, qcf+BC (doing his qcf C while activating HD).
 ∟Clark canceling a non-cancelable normal such as his second hit of his close C into his Ex hcf K but simply
    doing hcf+BCD (all you'll see is s.C [2hits], hcf BD w/HD automatically)
 ∟Leona's V-Slasher DM (air.qcf~hcb+P) can be performed air.qcf~hcb+ABC which will make her do her
    Ex V Slasher while going into HD mode at the same, of course you want to MaxCancel into her NeoMax
 ∟Anytime you activate the BC off a normal late, a s.C will come out instead of the autodash.  
 ∟Anytime you activate the BC off a normal early, the autodash will be activated.
 ∟Ex specials like Shen's command throw, hcb~f+ABC (Arcadia says to prevent overlap do hcb~ub~up~uf+ABC).  
    You can also do the same motion in the air but you have to complete the motion before you land to
    go straight into HD.  Same applies to Goro and Clark.

Kusogaki of KOF UK Fame, illustrates the technique nicely on this clip.


Damage scaling:

- Every hit past the first one takes a 5% damage scaling cut.
- Damage scaling is normally capped at 20%. However, DMs and EX DMs damage scaling is capped at 40% whereas NeoMaxes are capped at 50%.  (Example given in the mook is if you have a 100 damage attack, no the 18th hit, you’d expect the damage to be 100 x (1- (17*0.05)) = 15, but the actual damage is 20. No actual example of a move in game is given however!) UPDATE: In console, DM's now are capped at 40% while NMs stay at 50%
- When doing a Max Cancel, the Neo Max ignores the regular damage scaling formula, but suffers damage scaling equal to the DM that was used for the Max Cancel. TLDR: Max Cancelling gives you slightly better damage scaling.
- Some multi hit DMs suffer the same damage scaling through all hits (e.g. if the first hit of a 6 hit DM suffers from 75% damage scaling, all 6 hits are scaled to 75%)
- Some moves are free from damage scaling entirely. Supposed to be common for the last hit of “Lock” type moves (once the first hit connects, the rest of the move connects as though the opponent is caught).
- Lowest damage value in the game is 4, hence if moves would suffer from damage scaling that would push them to a value less than 4, it’s bumped up to 4.

 

2780
Ryo Sakazaki / Re: Ryo Sakazaki
« on: August 17, 2010, 09:11:18 AM »
Is it possible to parry multi hit attacks?

Word is that you can only parry one hit now, so multiple hitting moves are going to be a problem for Ryo--needs to be confirmed.

2781
Offline Matchmaking / Re: SoCal KoF
« on: August 17, 2010, 09:07:51 AM »
Brian, Steph and Bao.  GG today, the competition is getting steeper everyday.  Tentatively we're going to do the Ranbat on this Saturday now, we feel that we won't have enough time Friday.  Keep checking here to stay informed.

2782
Wouldn't it be a good idea to actually start a new thread on roll canceling?
Seems like something kind of important/specific to the KOFXIII engine.

It is, but I think we need to explore it a bit more before we'll know if it warrants a new thread.  So far, it's not as versatile as expected but as time progresses we'll see (Furthermore, not enough ppl have exposure to XIII to test out the limitations of roll cancellation).  Welcome to DC Phoenix. =) 

2783
Chin Gentsai / Re: Chin Gentsai
« on: August 16, 2010, 04:32:28 PM »
Impressive, thank a lot :D i'm looking for chin (i use him already in 98) in XIII. Could you add a last info? if a move (normal/special/super) are safe or free to punish, from what your experience learn of course.

i don't unsertand a thing, the taunt, act like the drink special, or do exactly the same thing too (charge a drink counter) slower ?

I'm still not done with the write-up, but none of his specials or supers are completely safe, even a well spaced hcf+K (blocked), qcb+ A (blocked) can be punished by characters with a long sweep (Robert).  EDIT: I suppose the Quickie Punches are completely safe, but you can free cancel out of it so that kinda doesn't count. The taunt basically makes him do his drink five times in a row...only you can't stop him once he starts drinking, and he actually gets drunk in the end (new animation) lol.

EDIT2: Done now. =)

EDIT3: Added: You can do s.C, qcb+BC and it'll do his qcb C+HD.  I suppose, but not confirmed, you can do qcb+BC off the Quickie Punches as well.  UPDATE: It will not bypass from the quickie punches.

-Added HD: s.C, HD, s.C, (qcb A, [HDC] hcf D) x2, (df.B, qcb C, [HDC] hcf D) x2, df.B, qcf x2+P DM [6hits], [MC] qcf x2+BD, df.B, qcfx2+P DM (929dmg, 5 stocks, if you drink it'll go over 1000).

UPDATE2: I did a slight variation of Chin's first HD combo: s.C, HD, s.C, qcb A, [HDC] hcf B, qcb A, [HDC] hcf D, (df.B, qcb C, hcf D) x3, df.B x5, qcf x2+AC DM (789dmg, 36hits)

2784
reversal wakeup uppercuts in sf4 are why i'm taking up KoF13 hahahhaha god i hate reversals in sf4. that game is soo frustrating sometimes, its stupid hhahaha

I do like the Risk/Reward balance in KoFXIII, from what I've seen, much more than SFIV.

It appears much more "traditional" than IV's odd systems of FANTASTIC reversal options on some characters, and horrific, barely useable ones on others. The lack of auto correct also is great; one habit I've always loved in other 2D games was to jump in such a way that the opponents wakeup SRK went in the opposite direction from where I jumped. SFIV totally invalidates this.

Is there anyone that lacks a decent reversal in XIII? I can't think of any mentions of characters feeling like they're needlessly missing tools , especially since there are so many useful EX moves. Chin lacks Range, and Takuma lacks a traditional DP, but they obviously make up for it in other areas, and at least have meter-dependent skills (or non-meter dependent combo abilities) that make up for the lacking parts.

In all, I just prefer KoF's approach and defense methods. Even if XIII had auto correct and SRK -> FADC -> Ultra, I'd still feel like the opponent "deserves" the damage he landed on me more, than they do in SF, since I have so many more options on wakeup.

Chin still lacks a good anti-air if they are above you.  Sure he has one hell of a Ex counter move, but it doesn't stop the empty hoppers/jumpers.  In fact, Shen has the same problem except his d.C is decent but slow to come out.  His qcf+K is not useful for anti-air unless it's used somewhat preemptively.

EDIT: I'm pretty sure this has not been posted before; I found out something new in XIII.

Roll canceling - Any character can cancel out of a roll (at least a forward one) by activating HD.  It acts like canceling into HD from a normal and will for the most part do a s.C (just like d.B, d.B, d.BC does a s.C) but I'll have to test it some more.  Alternatively, you can try performing a special with BC, like K' can do roll cancel into dp+BC, great for juggling.  In fact, for now at least, I think the implications of roll canceling are only for juggling  (except the rare 'surprise' move).

Testing it with Chin is somewhat interesting:  If you perform qcb+BC by itself, from a idle stance, he'll execute qcb B+HD (his counter walk).   If you do roll --> roll cancel qcb+BC he'll do qcb C+HD, which is infinitely more useful than his counter walk.   EDIT2: Hmm now that I think about it counter walk+HD isn't so bad afterall, I'll probably continue this discussion in Chin's thread though.

EDIT3: "Phoenix" over in the IRC channel brought up a good potential usage that'll we'll have to test out:  Roll canceling after GuardCancel Rolls.  Now I can see how a HD-s.C would be useful now.  Crazy if this works out.

EDIT4: Ok so the GCAB does not work. Also after testing, you can only roll cancel if you dash roll.

2785
Chin Gentsai / Re: Chin Gentsai
« on: August 16, 2010, 01:07:03 AM »
Can you describe what all the moves do? It's been a long time since I played XII.

I thought it was clear that I was on it, lol, but ok I'm on it.

2786
Raiden / Re: Raiden
« on: August 15, 2010, 10:02:17 PM »
you didnt try finishing with his nm? i wish you tried to do those ex tackles after the last dropkick, or at least his nm after it. if another ex tackle is possible, dayumn for posibilities. this would still hold the door open for his nm, cause youd still have 3 stocks after it and a full hd meter. the 12 second one might hurt a LOT.

Well of course you can do the standard: s.A (as an anti air possibility as well), Max D Dropkick,  s.A, Max B Dropkick, NM.

To add to it, you want to charge to level 4 (Max) since it has much more range and better recovery, although level 3 does work.  In the meantime, you'll lose the ability to j.CD, crossup D, d.B combos, GCCDs, GCABs, AB roll, AB tech roll...

FYI: The Dune vids had a short training mode session with Raiden, seen .

2787
no I said it comes pretty close, it can be punished by a lot but for the most part its pretty hard to get a max punish that does a lot of damage and be careful on the timing of your punish because the old repeat srk trick is actually practical with him works on badly timed punish attempts

I think I fell for 1991 against your Ryo lol a couple of times. LOL:)

2788
Ryo Sakazaki / Re: Ryo Sakazaki
« on: August 15, 2010, 11:15:09 AM »
Kinda sucks that we haven't seen many matches featuring Ryo but I have noticed that his NeoMax has some big time damage to it. Is it possible that this is the highest damaging NM in the game?

Ryo's NM does 480.  Goro's does 500 as mentioned before (Maxima does 450).  EDIT: King does (1-17)x30 damage, if all 17 hits she's the new queen in damage for a 510.

2789
Raiden / Re: Raiden
« on: August 15, 2010, 11:08:17 AM »
Don't know if this helps, here's a translate.google.com version of his levels:

Level 1: 4 sec Entertainment, occurred late, not invincible, after guard against substantial
Level 2: Entertainment 08 seconds, occurred late, a bit invincible, then guard against
Level 3: Entertainment 12s usually occur invincible determination to attack occurred, then guard against fine, whatever decision
Level 4: 16 sec Entertainment, early experience, offensive invincible determination to disappear, then guard against fine, whatever decision

---
Entertainment = charge

2790
Offline Matchmaking / Re: SoCal KoF
« on: August 14, 2010, 01:43:59 PM »
Now you we finally met, you can play one of our characters any time.

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